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Kites! Kites! Kites! => Kite Building and Repair => Topic started by: KiteChemist on August 21, 2013, 11:55 AM



Title: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 21, 2013, 11:55 AM
Finally I published the project

Have fun and don't forget to post photos/videos/impressions


https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dzyvkckxyv95yh2/Q8iBUWwI7R (https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dzyvkckxyv95yh2/Q8iBUWwI7R)

 :)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on August 21, 2013, 04:57 PM
Looks great.  Thanks for the generous addition to the collection of free plans.

Forgive me if I am being ignorant.  What are the two target points on the trailing edge?  (on the outer ends of panel D)


Title: Re: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: jecko on August 21, 2013, 06:52 PM
Thank you, for sharing. Looks good.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 22, 2013, 01:30 AM
Looks great.  Thanks for the generous addition to the collection of free plans.

Forgive me if I am being ignorant.  What are the two target points on the trailing edge?  (on the outer ends of panel D)

ignore them, those are control points for sail design :-)
The only important points are standoffs marks :-)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on August 24, 2013, 02:21 AM
Slight change to the panel layout....

(http://images54.fotki.com/v104/photos/7/1814857/11777781/lilith-vi.gif)
(http://images52.fotki.com/v644/photos/7/1814857/11777781/lilith1a-vi.jpg)

Fingers crossed for a bit of free time next week - stage 2!


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 24, 2013, 03:04 AM
Simply beautiful color schemes!!! They outperform the original scheme!! I like them!!!

Are you building the std or the light version?

Should I update the project with panel E divided into stripes?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on August 24, 2013, 04:04 AM
Simply beautiful color schemes!!! They outperform the original scheme!! I like them!!!


Thank you!  I'm glad you approve.

Are you building the std or the light version?

I'm building the light version this time.

Should I update the project with panel E divided into stripes?

If you like this panel layout, please use it and make it available for anyone else.

I extended panel H and panel G past panel C.  Then I made the border between panel D and panel E parallel to the new section of G.  Next I made the border between panel E and panel F go in a similar direction to panel C (not quite parallel, a little bit more "radial"), and added a stripe.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 24, 2013, 06:06 AM
You made the changes on the or on paper? Seems very clear, :-)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: sugarbaker on August 24, 2013, 07:49 AM
Jonathan, I'm wondering if you'd be willing to share the CAD files so that I could update the panel design for my own use?  I fully intend to build a lightweight version of the kite and really like the panel layout mods that Kevin came up with.  Or, if you intend to update, I will wait for the newer PDF format.  Either way, I'm looking forward to adding Lilith to my build list.

Kevin, you color schemes look great!


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 24, 2013, 08:27 AM
Ok, if you need I can share dwg files. I will update tje current version with the beautiful color scheme, leaving the old one for the lazy builders.

Remember thar for the light version you need: 2 x 2PTs for upper leading edge, 2 x P1Xs for lower leading edge, 2 x 3PTs for lower spreader, 5mm exel for upper spreader, and a long 3PT or a short 3PT+ 1.5 cm P200 + 6.1mm hollow ferrule for spine


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: sugarbaker on August 24, 2013, 08:59 AM
DWG files would be excellent. And I think I've got the frame items in my current supply.  Thanks!


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 25, 2013, 02:08 PM
Hi

Here it is the update with DWG files included.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/1chez39i7entt29/LeWjyqBhZ9 (https://www.dropbox.com/sh/1chez39i7entt29/LeWjyqBhZ9)



Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on August 25, 2013, 11:51 PM
great panel-layout

the original, but i like kevin's a bit more



Krijn


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 26, 2013, 02:43 AM
Both versions are available. The simpler one, for lazy builders (like me :D) and the more complex for hardcore builders (26 panels)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Lou on August 26, 2013, 04:47 PM
Wow beautiful kite and have been looking for a stunning LW to build.  I think i found my new project and will start this weekend.  I'm feeling up for the 26 panel!!

Thanks for the updated files!


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: sugarbaker on August 26, 2013, 05:43 PM
Thanks Jonathan and Kevin for what looks like a fun kite and a collaborative graphics effort. 

Jonathan, I also appreciate the CAD files.  Even though I suspect I'll go with Kevin's graphic layout, it is nice to be able to format for U.S. print sizes (36 inches wide) opposed to the A0 format.  While I'm happy either way, it sometimes confuses the folks at my local printer.  Thanks again, I'm currently moving (again!) and look forward to my next house, as I think I'll have a dedicated kite space... the biggest and best I've ever had!  Then I can get moving on some projects I've had waiting. 



Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 27, 2013, 12:41 AM
Great! My space is half of a 15 sqm room :D, and also shares with electronics :D


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on August 27, 2013, 02:08 AM
Ooh!  Just logged in after a couple of days absence.

Jonathon, thanks for updating the files with the newer graphic - you didn't need to credit me, I wouldn't have come up with the modification without your original design, so it's still your design  :)

Yes, I drew over a printout of your original plan, I didn't recreate it.  I made a mistake when cutting out, but didn't realize until I read your comment about 26 panels.  Thankfully I hadn't sewn anything, BUT peeling some of the sail apart and installing the correct panels was a painstaking process.

However, this does also mean the updated plan isn't exactly the same as my colour samples.  Panel B should extend through panel G.  (This was the mistake I made when cutting the panels originally.)  SORRY!!!  :(

I'm hoping to get a few hours on the project tomorrow.  Pics to follow


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 27, 2013, 05:43 AM
Ooh!  Just logged in after a couple of days absence.

Jonathon, thanks for updating the files with the newer graphic - you didn't need to credit me, I wouldn't have come up with the modification without your original design, so it's still your design  :)


I  thought it was correct to credit you :-)

Hope that your project proceeds without problems :-) I'm curious to see how it will look in air :-)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on August 28, 2013, 08:27 PM
Here is a PNG file you can use for choosing colour combinations in MS Draw

(http://www.ozfeathers.com.au/kaos/downloads/lilith_blank.png)

Right click and "Save Image as" (Ctrl + click on a Mac)

or if you prefer, a CDR (Corel Draw) version can be downloaded from HERE (http://www.ozfeathers.com.au/kaos/downloads/lilith_blank.cdr)



Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 29, 2013, 03:30 AM
Should I add this in dropbox?  :)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on August 29, 2013, 03:36 AM
Should I add this in dropbox?  :)

Yes, that's a good idea.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 29, 2013, 05:32 AM
The internal message service is down so i post here the reply about standoffs:

"The lenght of the standoff is meant "carbon-only" so with the connectors the distance beetween lower-spreader axys and sail is much more than the pure standoff lenght. What type of sail connectors are you using? I'm using r-sky ones that are 1-1.5 cm longher than jaco for example. If you are using jaco i suggest you to increase the lenght of 15mm. Sorry that I forgot to mention that the sail connectors i used where r-sky ones

Again for the upper spreader the lenght is carbon only and the distance from the nose of the upper connector is the distance from nose axys to bottom of the apa, maybe this is the cause of the problem (the upper TAPAs are too low)"


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on August 29, 2013, 08:53 AM
maybe it is more useful to give the distance from sail to lowerspreader instead of the carbonlength

(i will build a lilith ul and i will be using other apa's, so it would be useful for me)



right now i'm clicking and clicking using kevin's template...



Krijn


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on August 29, 2013, 05:41 PM
Waiting for light winds...

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/v/1236138_10201395042551536_1203447996_n.jpg?oh=58727da9c59d652636c633d620b6c002&oe=52223177&__gda__=1377968901_d8207252616a7681f879c3e6208aced0)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: mdilucca on August 29, 2013, 07:48 PM
Very sexy Kevin  :D Looking forward to your report :)

Cheers
Mario


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 30, 2013, 12:39 AM
Very beautiful. It looks great with this panel layout

Only a note: the lower spreader TAPAs seems 10-15 mm too low, just make sure that , like the upper spreader, the distance is taken from the bottom of the apa to the spine axys on the top of the nose.

3pt spreaders :-) ?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on August 30, 2013, 02:28 AM
My mistake... I had the centre of the TAPAs at the measured distance.   :-[  Amazing what a difference that small amount makes.

I've corrected that, and have added 1cm to each standoff (using Jaco fittings).  Looking really good, just got to wait for light winds.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 30, 2013, 03:36 AM
It can be pushed up to 18kmh winds without destroying and still being controllable, but tricks are difficult over 15kmh because it is a UL-SUL hybrid. Waiting to hear your impressions and, eventually, a video :-)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on August 30, 2013, 04:05 AM
looking great kevin!


so all the measurements from jonathan are correct?  :)



i'm trying to make a nice colorcombination, i already discovered the panellayout is very suitable for those medium pieces of scrap-icarex  ;D


Krijn


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 30, 2013, 05:34 AM
The measurements are correct but i forgot to mention from which point they are measured.

The leading edge apas are measured from apa-bottom to the spine axys in the nose (the center of the top of the nose)

The weakes point are the standoff lenght, since it is the carbon lenght, but the effective lenght depends on the type of sail connectors used, so probably i should add the distance from lower spreader axis to sail just to avoind confusion.

any ideas to avoid misunderstandings?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: photogbill on August 30, 2013, 05:12 PM
The measurements are correct but i forgot to mention from which point they are measured.

The leading edge apas are measured from apa-bottom to the spine axys in the nose (the center of the top of the nose)

The weakes point are the standoff lenght, since it is the carbon lenght, but the effective lenght depends on the type of sail connectors used, so probably i should add the distance from lower spreader axis to sail just to avoind confusion.

any ideas to avoid misunderstandings?

Both of those are great ideas! It's been a guessing game for me with previous builds as to where 'exactly' to take my LE connector measurements & sail connectors lengths from!

By the way, Great looking kite design! I'm just finishing my current Invictus builds and will be taking a little break on building but will probably build a Lilith eventually! I'm not sure if I missed a posting or not but are there any flying videos available with the Lilith?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on August 31, 2013, 02:10 AM
Lilith .L (mine is a ghost):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH-EFpmu_B (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH-EFpmu_B)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1eBsSJgoXc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1eBsSJgoXc)

Lilith .N (standard):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vK5LNtV1Snk&feature=youtube_gdata_player (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vK5LNtV1Snk&feature=youtube_gdata_player)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 02, 2013, 03:17 PM
I think I have just enough lightgrey and darkgrey to build this UL (color is Teal):

(http://i41.tinypic.com/33dziqe.jpg)

It may take a while. No hurry, one step at the time.

And I want to optimize my sewing at the start and end of a stitch in the middle of the sail (do you know what I mean? "Tie off" says GoogleTranslate).


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 02, 2013, 03:57 PM
Interesting color scheme, probably it will be beautiful when finished!

What do you mean about the sewing?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: sugarbaker on September 02, 2013, 08:31 PM
Krijn,  I know that color scheme... looks like Tom's SS.  I wish teal was still available, I'd build a similar layout! 


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: tpatter on September 02, 2013, 08:56 PM
Krijn,  I know that color scheme... looks like Tom's SS.  I wish teal was still available, I'd build a similar layout! 

Haha!

In our email threads, I was worried that Krijn would decide to keep the kite!  :).   He mentioned that his wife liked how it turned out - I thought I was toast!   :)

I love how this kite looks - sweet design.  Did you consider swapping the light grey and teal sections?  I wonder how that would look.  I'm thinking that the 'teal arrow' would provide a forward looking direction to the kite which might work well.  Just a thought....

And yes, a little teal really looks sharp with another light and darker color!   


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 02, 2013, 11:44 PM
 :D

yes tom, i considered the swap between lightgrey and teal, but i didn't like it (and maybe there is not enough lightgrey left rigth here)

i also considered pinstriping (also only around the teal panels), but i won't do that on this kite


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 03, 2013, 12:45 AM
What do you mean about the sewing?

When I start a seam I just use the three-step-zig-zag and go back and forward for 1 2 cm. The same at the end of the seam.
Looking reasonable (often black thread on black underground (pinstriping or dacron)), but now I know I can do better.

I just have to try some things out, maybe using the setting of my sewing machine.
I know Sugarbaker and Tom (from the Quartz) have good tips. But I think that takes lots of time, isn't it, Stephen?

Krijn


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 03, 2013, 01:36 AM
I usually do it :-)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: coogee on September 03, 2013, 01:57 AM
He Krijn nice colour layout, the teal looks good!
 Mike


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: sugarbaker on September 03, 2013, 07:20 PM
For seams that end in the middle of the sail, I typically pull the thread through to the back and tie off with a surgeon's knot (three knots actually).  For seams that end at the edge of the sail, I drop the feed dogs on my sewing machine and make 3 or 4 stitches in place/overlapping.  This method works well, and I cut the thread right against the cloth.  If a small amount pokes back through the sail, I melt it back with a lighter (be very careful not to melt a hole in your sail).

I think if you're willing to spend the time, the easiest method that also looks neat/tidy is to tie off each seam.  Dropping the feed dogs works great for me, but only if your tension is set up well (a good sewing machine helps... ). 


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 04, 2013, 07:10 AM
thanks


and what if i have to start a seam in the middle of the sail? i count three of them in this kite (kevin's layout)

is this an option (also for ending a seam):
just stitch the three-step-zig-zag and at the end set the machine to a setting with no forward move, will the machine just stitch from left to right? (i don't now if a (mine) machine has such a setting)


Krijn


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on September 04, 2013, 08:10 AM
thanks


and what if i have to start a seam in the middle of the sail? i count three of them in this kite (kevin's layout)

is this an option (also for ending a seam):
just stitch the three-step-zig-zag and at the end set the machine to a setting with no forward move, will the machine just stitch from left to right? (i don't now if a (mine) machine has such a setting)


Krijn

I begin and end  seams at one side of the three step zig zag, stop after one diagonal (3 stitches), then back tack over it (3 stitches) then overstitch and continue.  At each end, I cut the threads close to the sail and heat seal with a lighter. Looks very neat, and never comes undone.

I never tie knots on the ends of threads.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: sugarbaker on September 04, 2013, 02:45 PM
The other thing you could try is when you get to the end of your seam, instead of dropping the feed dogs like I do, you could just set your length dial to "0".  The needle will still stitch side to side, but will overlap previous stitches with no forward progression.  Be mindful that this may cause ripstop to bunch up a that area if there is too much tension in the thread. Also, it will leave a little straight line (three stitches wide) perpendicular to the direction you were stitching. 

For starting in the center of the sail, if it is just ripstop being sewn, I leave some length to the thread prior to stitching and come back and tie it off.  I will likely try Kevin's method, although it is hard as I often use a "serpentine" stitch and wouldn't line up.  It will be easier with a 3 step zig zag to coordinate where it will start and stop in the cycle.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: chilese on September 04, 2013, 09:50 PM
I'm begging one of you amazing builders to do a "weave" version of this nice layout.

The yellow was just for me, sorry.

Sorry for the quick and dirty mashup.  ::)

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Q3-npGFJxbU/UigM7rYu7CI/AAAAAAABPTY/uVTQiULSUGM/s800/Weave.jpg) (https://picasaweb.google.com/chilesej/Artwork#5919995929576795170)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 05, 2013, 01:43 AM
The panel boundaries are a bit different, there are very small panels like the square one. This is wanted?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 05, 2013, 05:14 AM

Pfff, a lot of panels...
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2q8ymf4.jpg)

Hotcutting done!
(http://i41.tinypic.com/nn5gle.jpg)

(http://i41.tinypic.com/28txif8.jpg)
This is totally acceptable for me (middle stitch, under is a too thick needle used). Much better looking than just using the reverse. Thanks Sugarbaker.


Krijn


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: sugarbaker on September 05, 2013, 07:06 PM
Glad it's working for you Krijn!  I am anxious to see your sail when it is completed.  As for my won builds... I won't have any progress until middle of October, as my wife and I are traveling to italy and France in the coming weeks!  Looking forward to a trip to your side of the world. 


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 06, 2013, 03:28 AM
When are you arriving in Italy? Ad the end of september there is a festival in Cervia, called SprintKite. If you are close to that location you may consider to stop a day to visit us :-)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 06, 2013, 05:30 AM
Ok, all went smooth.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2lmkj1l.jpg)

Nice to attach the centrecross-reinforcement on a small piece in stead of a big sail. I did that before gluing and stitching it to the rest.  ;)
(http://i42.tinypic.com/wgq7h0.jpg)

(Upperspreaderpatch will be done with adhesive Velcro, after the kite is framed.)

Project will be on hold for a few days now.
I'll be back.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 06, 2013, 07:59 AM
You are very fast :-)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: tpatter on September 06, 2013, 08:37 AM
Gorgeous!  Would match my SS quite well.  I can't wait for your video. :)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 06, 2013, 11:20 AM
Jonathan, what is the distance from lower spreader to sail? I need them because I'll use different connectors. I want the kite to be the same as you designed.

Thanks.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 06, 2013, 03:41 PM
Do you mean the distance between the sail and the lower spreader center along the standoffs?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 06, 2013, 09:06 PM
Yeah, please.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 07, 2013, 04:45 AM
It is 27,0cm for the inner standoff and 26,2cm for the outer one , as measured on my Lilith Ghost, taken from the rear of the sail to the spreader center axis


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 11, 2013, 04:36 AM
done

i've found the right supplies to make round cut-outs in the leading edge, i think i'll never use another method:
(http://i44.tinypic.com/23mpw0i.jpg)

(http://i42.tinypic.com/24vmet1.jpg)

tail:
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2jg5b3k.jpg)

finished lilith.l:
(http://i43.tinypic.com/205uzi1.jpg)


Krijn


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 11, 2013, 06:37 AM
Sweeeeeeeeeeeeet  ;)

Waiting for your impressions and videos   8)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: sugarbaker on September 11, 2013, 07:23 AM
Well done Krijn!  I'm excited to get working on some kites again this winter.  As I have a new space to call my studio.  Currently, as my wife and I have just moved, the space is being used for storage, but that will soon change (after my trip to Italy and France of course!).

On that note, I don't know if I'll be able to get over to Cervia for the festival.  I'm still looking into it.  We will be in the North East region (Aosta Valley) on those days, but I may rent a motorcycle and ride west in order to meet up.  We'll see.

Anyway, your kite looks great. 


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Lou on September 12, 2013, 11:03 AM
done

i've found the right supplies to make round cut-outs in the leading edge, i think i'll never use another method:
([url]http://i44.tinypic.com/23mpw0i.jpg[/url])

([url]http://i42.tinypic.com/24vmet1.jpg[/url])

tail:
([url]http://i39.tinypic.com/2jg5b3k.jpg[/url])

finished lilith.l:
([url]http://i43.tinypic.com/205uzi1.jpg[/url])


Krijn


Is it a punch or a stencil cutout and hotcut process.  Im very interested.. looks nice and clean!


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 12, 2013, 01:22 PM
Is it a punch or a stencil cutout and hotcut process.  Im very interested.. looks nice and clean!


Hotcut.

This is how I do the Leading Edges:
1) Cut and fold a strip of Dacron (Spinnaker in this case).
2) Fold 5cm back and cut a small triangle from the last 5cm at both sides. I mean the part that would stick out when folded back and folded in length if you don't cut it (just try). Sorry, English is not my motherlanguage. I had a bad grade in highschool  >:(.
3) Now glue the strip to the back of the kite, starting at the wingtip. Just make sure the sail is exactly touching the fold. I do not tape the Dacron to the A0-plan or something like that.
4) Use a pencil to mark the place of the cutouts (they are on the sail already in my case, I did that when glueing the sailhalfs).
5) Now find yourself a soldering iron with a sharp point (see below, at the bottom my other soldering iron) and a piece of metal with a hole in it with a size of 12mm (10mm was too small, maybe 14mm is needed with thicker rods). I found it in DIY-shop, I think it is used in plumbing. I tried this with cardboard, but that doesn't work!

(http://i40.tinypic.com/vo1ikx.jpg)

6) Cut the holes 1 2 mm from the fold in the Dacron. Closer: the hole will wear, further: there will be an ugly bend in your leading edge. WARNING: be very careful with a big sail and a sizzling hot iron on one table! Especially when you move the sail. (Yes, I had a small accident once. That set me back in focus for the builds after that.)
7) Glue the Dacron flat and stitch it.

Maybe some of the steps are unnecessary to explain, but now it is a complete instruction.


Now off to the plumbing store!
Good luck!

Krijn


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 12, 2013, 01:25 PM
By the way, Sugarbaker uses this and I copied it (it is also done on Vendetta's). He explained it also in the B'zar-thread, using the technique by making the holes before you'll glue the leading edge to the kite.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: thief on September 12, 2013, 02:20 PM
sounds like you need to build up one of Gary Engvall's hot tool stand.
https://sites.google.com/site/kites4all/home/hot-tools


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Lou on September 12, 2013, 02:45 PM
By the way, Sugarbaker uses this and I copied it (it is also done on Vendetta's). He explained it also in the B'zar-thread, using the technique by making the holes before you'll glue the leading edge to the kite.

Ok, yes I have used this method to create holes in other areas of assembly.  I thought maybe there was a device that you may have been using to avoid using heat.   :)

I have used the slit method for creating the opening on the leading which do get fairly weathered from flight.  I will attempt to convert to holes or just use holes in future builds.  I will need to at least find a washer with a 14-15mm opening though.  Should not be hard to locate. 

Thanks for the feedback and again wonderful looking build.


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 16, 2013, 02:47 PM
Any impressions about the Lilith? Do you like it?  :)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KaoS on September 16, 2013, 04:25 PM
Any impressions about the Lilith? Do you like it?  :)

I'm still waiting for some good wind  :(


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 17, 2013, 01:01 AM
I did fly it (much too) short.
I will give a mini-review later.

Some points:
 - very flat tazmachine
 - good, stable backflip and fade
 - weird feeling in the slotmachine
 - very light kite

I already played with the thoughts to replace the 2pt's in the upperleading edge with 3pt's, because the leading edges felt a bit weak (also in the precision, flying corners).
Have you tried that, Jonathan?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 17, 2013, 01:03 AM
I like the looks very much, by the way:
(http://i42.tinypic.com/es98hk.jpg)


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: mr wojtas on September 17, 2013, 03:36 AM
Are you gonna take it to Bergeijk?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 17, 2013, 05:16 AM
I did fly it (much too) short.
I will give a mini-review later.

Some points:
 - very flat tazmachine
 - good, stable backflip and fade
 - weird feeling in the slotmachine
 - very light kite

I already played with the thoughts to replace the 2pt's in the upperleading edge with 3pt's, because the leading edges felt a bit weak (also in the precision, flying corners).
Have you tried that, Jonathan?



I didn't tried 3pt on the upper leading edge since i wanted a UL-SUL hybrid, but the precision didn't seem bad with 3pt's. The softer upper leading edge helps to regain and maintain pressure after a corner.

I can confirm about the weird feeling of the slotmachine, anyway it can give access to the slot-to-taz combo if you shoot a slot machine with very high nose.

It can also yoyo one pop :)

How the 3pt upper leading edge affect the flight characteristics?




Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 17, 2013, 12:02 PM
Are you gonna take it to Bergeijk?

in may?


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: Krijn on September 17, 2013, 12:03 PM
first i have to fly it a lot more with the 2pt's

if i change anything, i will let you know, and also the result of the change



Krijn


Title: Re: Lilith free project
Post by: KiteChemist on September 17, 2013, 02:12 PM
Yes, before changing test it in the original setup. This configuration I think is the best comprimise between trickability and lightness