GWTW Forum

Kite Land Talk => Website Discussion => Topic started by: TGunn on October 22, 2009, 11:01 AM



Title: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: TGunn on October 22, 2009, 11:01 AM
I just got off the phone with Jon trennepohl and he is at a trade show, where he is partnered up with RC flyers we met in Jamaica last year and this year, and a new Division of Premier Kites company has started, named "Premier RC Vector Powered Kites"   

Link Removed: Il Duce (One of the few rules Steve has is no direct links to websites selling kites. I'm afraid this falls into that category.)

Jon is supplying the carbon and fabric to the company making these RC controlled kites that can be flown indoor or outdoor. Go to the website and you can see videos of the kites and how they work. They're pretty awsome! What's kind of wierd is that the kite's they chose to make are winged box kites, tetrahedral kites, and a couple others.

They look fun and easy to fly!


Title: Re: Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: DWayne on October 22, 2009, 11:14 AM
$450  ???   And it doesn't look as fun as a real kite or an RC Copter.

Denny


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: thief on October 22, 2009, 01:18 PM
interesting...too bad they are not making their kite line look as neat as those!!!!

that whole idea started off with Daniel Prentiss(-ice) putting a small motor and a couple of servos into a Shanti Cube.....VERY cool!!!!!!!!!

see if it helps Premier at all...some of those are kinda pricey!


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Allen Carter on October 22, 2009, 07:46 PM
This begs the question:

Is it a kite if there's no string?


By definition:

"A kite is a flying tethered aircraft that depends upon the tension of a tethering system"


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: normofthenorth on October 22, 2009, 11:48 PM
No more a real kite than a hang-glider is a kite -- but we can all see the lineage. . .


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Allen Carter on October 23, 2009, 01:34 AM
They certainly look like a very different flying experience. Expensive novelty, or do they really have something there?


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: RobB on October 23, 2009, 02:27 AM
Those are pretty cool looking. Probably be alot of fun for zero wind conditions... But I've got to ask myself... buzzy toy or Fearless SUL? My budget doesn't have room for both... I think the FL wins every time.
 ;)
~Rob.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: mikenchico on October 23, 2009, 11:27 PM
Very cool.

I'd been planning to power up my Carsten Canard for those no wind days for a year or so, beat too it again. Oh well ... A Platz Glider was the next posibility if that had worked. Cool to see the theory's actually working even though significantly different from my thoughts, it does leave me room for my own experiments still.
 
Not technically a kite anymore but pretty cool regardless. 



Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: 711jrp on October 24, 2009, 02:29 AM
Link Removed: Il Duce (One of the few rules Steve has is no direct links to websites selling kites. I'm afraid this falls into that category.)

That's a bit harsh with Jon being a site sponser and all.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Steve Hall on October 24, 2009, 10:16 AM
Jon provides materials to many (if not most) of the higher end kites being made today.  If Premier would like a permanent link to that site they can certainly contact us and we can work something out.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: samlennon on December 04, 2009, 09:44 AM
Hello Kiteflyers,

As the art director for Premier Kites I feel that I can answer a fair amount of your issues.  Dear Thief, thank you for your feedback about our graphics.  This feedback would be better served if you made a comment directly to Premier. This can be done by going to the contact page on our website. Or you can find us on facbook and make all kind of comments there. As most people who know me are aware of, I am very fond of constructive feedback about our designs, which is why Premier quickly became the industry leader after my arrival, something of which I am very proud.   We will bear your feedback in mind, however, we do not put a lot of effort into our cellular kites because even our best selling box kites don't sell that well.
Allen Carter, yes, a kite is a heavier than air tethered aerodyne.  But, well, what else were we going to call the things?  I've really been bothered by the name all along but in all the months of product development I couldn't come up with something better than, RC Nylon and Carbon Rod Constructions.  Not very helpful for us in a sales area.
Also, as a kite enthusiast I was VERY skeptical about how fun these would be.  I hate to admit it, but they are very fun.  They were very well received at a local indoor kite fly.  We, the staff of Premier, have also enjoyed flying them when we were getting footage for our promotional videos.
While this is a great forum for the kite community, Premier will be happy to receive comments on our blog on the PremierRC website.  We love to be criticized because it gives us a chance to do better.
Warm regards,
Susan A. Lennon
kite designer, artist, and feisty *****


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: kiteking on December 05, 2009, 08:07 AM
Hello Kiteflyers,
...  But, well, what else were we going to call the things? 

Warm regards,
Susan A. Lennon
kite designer, artist, and feisty *****


How about UFO


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: John Welden on December 05, 2009, 08:58 AM
Look fun.  Hope you can get the costs down.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: xuzme720 on December 05, 2009, 05:53 PM


How about UFO
Been done... A superlight mylar 3D flyer...Actually, that was the IFO...


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: UPNET on December 06, 2009, 11:19 AM
WOW...interesting concept. As an RC pilot..who recently discovered kites, my hats off to you. Time will tell how the kite community will respond. Many RC pilots have no idea about the current state of the art of kites. I took my kite to the RC field...many pilots were grounded due to high winds. I pulled out my dual line kite..and started giving basic lessons to a few of the guy's. They were amazed. Many of the older pilot's used to fly control line planes...and picked it up fairly quickly.
Good Luck

Chris


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Gardner on December 06, 2009, 11:30 AM
I can't seem to find any information on this "awesome" invention. Is there a pic and discription somewhere?  It wasn't on the Premier site I found.
Gardner


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: kiten00b on December 07, 2009, 12:26 PM
I can't seem to find any information on this "awesome" invention. Is there a pic and discription somewhere?  It wasn't on the Premier site I found.
Gardner
Quote
Link Removed: Il Duce (One of the few rules Steve has is no direct links to websites selling kites. I'm afraid this falls into that category.)

I'd suggest googling for "Premier Vector Powered Kite" and checking on the 4th or 5th link


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: indigo_wolf on December 07, 2009, 04:22 PM
I can't seem to find any information on this "awesome" invention. Is there a pic and discription somewhere?  It wasn't on the Premier site I found.
Gardner

Ooooooooohhh.... the omission of cross-links to a company micro-site is such a marketing faux-pas.  Time to flog the interns again.  ???  :'(  ;)

ATB,
Sam


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Coughitup on March 18, 2010, 04:56 PM
So I bought one of these. A rtf warm canard to be exact. I have taken it out in moderate winds(for the kite?). probably 3 to 5 mph. It flew well and once I got the hang of it, I really enjoyed it. It was a pleasure to leave the feild with nothing broke or missing. It definetly flys a lot different then any rc plane or helicopter I have flown. I would consider myself a rc novice. You basicaly point the vector thrust the way you want to go and the kite(term used very loosely) follows. It allows you to make some very sharp turns and 0 foot takeoffs. I got around 8 minutes of flying but I was initally using way too much power. I have never used any of the new type batteries but it takes a lot longer then the 20 minutes they say it takes to charge. Maybe the batteries need conditioning. The radio works well and is 2.4 ghz so the range is great. Kite constuction is good and the instuctions cover everything. Then connection on the canard for the power unit uses standard fittings. It would be interesting to mount this unit on a manta and do some gliding. I wish they would have included a bridle for powerless flying. This will be great for the wonderfull roseville flys ;).

Bryan


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: mikenchico on March 18, 2010, 06:50 PM
The Canard doesn't use a bridle, just a single point on the spine, a little pigtail larksheaded to the spine, with a couple of stoppers to define the adjustment range. If those stoppers are not on the kite/plane let me know and I'll get you the measurements for the placement, you could actually just mark the upper & lower points for reference.



Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Steve Hall on March 18, 2010, 07:27 PM
We should one here in Chico in a week or so.  We'll be sure to post some video.
If you need one there is a link posted on the right had side bar and you can buy direct from Premier RC or you can drop me an email and we can get you one also.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: xuzme720 on March 18, 2010, 07:35 PM
I might need to check one out... it might actually be cheaper since I have my own gear...well, electronics-wise anyway. ;D


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Coughitup on March 18, 2010, 08:25 PM
Quote
The Canard doesn't use a bridle, just a single point on the spine, a little pigtail larksheaded to the spine, with a couple of stoppers to define the adjustment range. If those stoppers are not on the kite/plane let me know and I'll get you the measurements for the placement, you could actually just mark the upper & lower points for reference.
That would be great Mike. I would really appreciate it. I imagine it  should fly just fine with the pigtail  in place.

Quote
We should one here in Chico in a week or so.  We'll be sure to post some video.
If you need one there is a link posted on the right had side bar and you can buy direct from Premier RC or you can drop me an email and we can get you one also.
I would have ordered through you Steve if I would have known that was an option. I will let you know when I am ready to try out some different models(or need some parts).

Quote
I might need to check one out... it might actually be cheaper since I have my own gear...well, electronics-wise anyway
For 40 more dollars you get a 4 channel receiver and transmitter. The manual states that the receiver is programable but there is no info on the site yet.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: xuzme720 on March 18, 2010, 09:30 PM
Quote
I might need to check one out... it might actually be cheaper since I have my own gear...well, electronics-wise anyway
For 40 more dollars you get a 4 channel receiver and transmitter. The manual states that the receiver is programable but there is no info on the site yet.
It will need to wait a little while as I have just bought a Saber II, a QPSUL, a 4D and the Tensor 5.0...
My kite budget is GONE for the near future!


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: tonycarl60 on March 19, 2010, 12:28 AM
Hey mike, I also have the vector Canard and if you can get the measurements for the line attachment, that will be greatly appreciated  :)


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: zippy8 on March 19, 2010, 01:21 AM
Nothing new under the sun....  ;)

(http://www.cobrakites.com/images/wndbgpx1.gif)

Nice story and more pics. here (http://www.eganfamily.id.au/archive30nov2007/monash/research/uav/aerobotics/aerobotics6.html).

Mike.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: zippy8 on March 19, 2010, 01:28 AM
I have never used any of the new type batteries but it takes a lot longer then the 20 minutes they say it takes to charge. Maybe the batteries need conditioning.

The term with multi-cell LiPos is "balancing"; getting all three cells in this case to the same voltage. It looks to me like the supplied charger doesn't have a balancer port so it is possible that the cells are mismatched, leading to poor run times and possibly to pack damage if one cell is dropping below 3.7volts during use. You'll get no joy from the techniques you'd employ with NiCad or NiMh cells (cycling, slow charging, etc.)

Oh yes... for recharging the normal recommendation is 1C - one times the pack's capacity - so all LiPo packs should take 1 hour to recharge. You get no performance benefit from fast charging (again unlike NiCad/NiMh) and the potential downside is... explosive (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3o_2mwRPdw#normal) Admittedly you can usually go to 3C (ie; those 20 minutes you mentioned) without problems.

It is neat looking kit though  :)

Mike.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Coughitup on March 19, 2010, 07:26 AM
Nothing new under the sun....  ;)

([url]http://www.cobrakites.com/images/wndbgpx1.gif[/url])

Nice story and more pics. here ([url]http://www.eganfamily.id.au/archive30nov2007/monash/research/uav/aerobotics/aerobotics6.html[/url]).

Mike.


I always thought those looked so cool. The big difference that jumps out to me is not having any flying surfaces.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Coughitup on March 19, 2010, 07:34 AM
Quote
The term with multi-cell LiPos is "balancing"; getting all three cells in this case to the same voltage. It looks to me like the supplied charger doesn't have a balancer port so it is possible that the cells are mismatched, leading to poor run times and possibly to pack damage if one cell is dropping below 3.7volts during use. You'll get no joy from the techniques you'd employ with NiCad or NiMh cells (cycling, slow charging, etc.)

Oh yes... for recharging the normal recommendation is 1C - one times the pack's capacity - so all LiPo packs should take 1 hour to recharge. You get no performance benefit from fast charging (again unlike NiCad/NiMh) and the potential downside is...

Obvioulsy I have been out of rc long enough for there to some major improvements in batteries. Thanks for the info. I will have to do some research.
Bryan


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: xuzme720 on March 19, 2010, 07:38 AM
Just be careful if you don't have a balancing charger...if the individual cells get too far out of sync with each other, you can have a fire just like shown in the video. Lipo's don't like to be overcharged!


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Coughitup on March 19, 2010, 11:19 AM
It says balance charger on the charger. So I guess it is ok. An hour just seems like a long time to recharge. Guess I will need some more packs. :)


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: xuzme720 on March 19, 2010, 11:43 AM
They do take a while to charge, not the old days with NiCads! But you can't beat the power to weight ratio with them! You will probably want to get at least 2 more packs, have all of them charged before you go out. You should almost be able to go nonstop with some judicious use of the left stick...


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: mikenchico on March 19, 2010, 12:06 PM
* Coughitup
* Tonycarl60


The bridle range on the spine is from 38.5" to 41" from the very front, nock included, I have mine sitting right in the middle of that and haven't played with it much to see if there is much difference. So I'm at 39.75".


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: tonycarl60 on March 19, 2010, 12:51 PM
The charger it comes with is a balance charger and has a balance port. Charge current is 1 amp, balance charge is .2 amp. The battery capacity is 1050 ma or a little over 1 amp and has a balance connector,  so a 1 hour charge time is reasonable for this charger. If you want a faster charge i.e. 3c then a different charger is needed, I personally like the Triton chargers. I have some 1300 ma batteries that I might try for more air time. There are also some chargers that will charge multiple batteries at the same time.

 I used to fly r/c but got tired of buying and charging all the batteries I would need for a day of flying. This is why I love kite flying, I can do it for hours on end and no batteries needed! When they invent a battery that charges in 1 minute and has a 1 hour run time then I might get back into r/c!


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: tonycarl60 on March 19, 2010, 12:53 PM
Mike, thanks for the measurement :)


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: Coughitup on March 19, 2010, 02:19 PM
Thanks Mike. :) I noticed two plugs on the charger one syas 25 and the other 35. The battery plugs into the 35. Do I use the 25? Definetly different from the nicads.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: tonycarl60 on March 20, 2010, 12:01 AM
The 35 port is for 3 cell packs which is what the kite came with and is why the connector fits, the 25 port is for 2 cell packs which the kite doesn't use.


Title: Re: Premier Vector Powered Kites -Awsome new products!
Post by: zippy8 on March 21, 2010, 11:33 AM
Wouldn't that be 3S and 2S ?

It's good that it has a balancing charger. Reassuring.

Mike.