GWTW Forum

Kites! Kites! Kites! => Sport Kites => Topic started by: flyjay77 on September 05, 2010, 10:30 PM



Title: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: flyjay77 on September 05, 2010, 10:30 PM
this may not be in the rite place ? but I am an old school kite guy and am use to clips on a kite . But I have been seing that the new kites dont have clips? I cant figure out how to conect the lines . dose anyone have a link to a video or can tell me how it works.

Jason,


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: Nitrobex on September 05, 2010, 10:33 PM
It's a larks head knot

http://www.ehow.com/how_13480_make-larks-head.html (http://www.ehow.com/how_13480_make-larks-head.html) -- text

Revolution Tutorial - Larks Head Knot (quad line stunt kite) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JjXraxUfMU#ws) -- video


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: flyjay77 on September 06, 2010, 07:32 AM
thats what I was thinking but didnt think that it would hold the full , didnt trust it , But I guess it works . thank you///

Jason,


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: flyjay77 on September 18, 2010, 06:17 AM
Can anyone tell me why this is the Standerd for kite fling nowdays ? why dont anyone use clips ? also what is the advantages on using this  on revolutions, I am just an old schooler and trying to get up to date .


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: lylenc on September 18, 2010, 06:43 AM
Less weight and less snags without the clips.


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: DonCrash on September 18, 2010, 07:02 AM
Also clips tend to destroy the lines (eventually after hours of usage). It's more designed for the average stunt kite fliers (average stunt kite fliers are those who only fly once every few months or so-ish.


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: Jeepster on September 18, 2010, 07:42 AM
thats what I was thinking but didnt think that it would hold the full , didnt trust it , But I guess it works . thank you///

Jason,

I use it on a SLK with 1200# line ... the kite makes the back end of my Jeep bounce when the wind is gusty.  No failures yet.  Was taught to use it by other BIG KITE fliers, so I'm not the first.

Cheers,
Tom


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: DD on September 18, 2010, 07:48 AM
Just an fyi, any kite boarding kites i have seen use the same larkshead to attach the lines to the kite so strength isnt a problem.


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: Nitrobex on September 18, 2010, 08:47 AM
Also a larks head knott is self tightning so the more tensionon the line the less likely it is to come loose I use it on sul's and never had it slip.


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: DWayne on September 18, 2010, 09:11 AM
Is a larks head really a knot, or is it a hitch?

Denny


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: DD on September 18, 2010, 10:18 AM
technically a larks head knot is a larks head hitch knot. When a line is attached to something it is called a hitch; as in the hitching post.


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: sealcove on September 18, 2010, 11:16 AM
This is also known as a girth hitch.  Interestingly enough it is a very weak knot in terms of how it stresses the line.  While it has plenty of friction to hold well, because of the sharp bends a girth hitch uses, it actually reduces the strength of the material by about 30% at the sharpest bend in the knot.  I speculate that the loss isn't quite as bad with tiny diameter kite line, but it is probably close.

 


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: DWayne on September 18, 2010, 11:30 AM
This is also known as a girth hitch. 

And we have a winner.  8)
A larks head is indeed a hitch and not a knot.  ;)

Denny


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: sealcove on September 18, 2010, 11:40 AM
:)

On the water it is more commonly called a cow hitch, and I am sure it has a bunch of other names. 


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: chilese on September 18, 2010, 12:22 PM
If you are concerned about reduced load capability.....

1 After you make the larkshead
2 Instead of attaching the knot to the tow point
3 Open the loop a bit, put thumb and forefinger through the loop
4 Make another larkshead
5 Attach tow point through 2nd larkshead

This will put 2 lines in the former weak area instead of 1
The first larkshead weak point is now in a much lower stress area
It adds a little itsy-bitsy teeny-weeny bit of weight to the tow point (for the super critical readers)

Don't know if there is a name for it. I just experimented with it one day when I noticed the increased wear spot on some sleeving.


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: sealcove on September 18, 2010, 03:20 PM
Based on your description, I am picturing a prusik.  Is this what you mean (you would tie it differently, but end up with the same result)?

(http://www2.worksafebc.com/i/guidelines/part11/guide11-2.gif)

If so, it has the same weakness as a girth hitch, but the reality is that any knot weakens a line to different degrees.  It is just good to know that when you are flying with 100lb test, you may only be getting 70-75lbs of strength out of the line because of the weakness at the knot.  More of a trivia tidbit than anything else.


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: Nitrobex on September 18, 2010, 06:52 PM
ok now that we have completely derailed the train, isn't sleeved line a higher poundage than the unsleeved portion (assuming you have sleeved ends)


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: chilese on September 18, 2010, 09:51 PM
No, a Prussik knot is not what i hoped to describe.

My method puts 2 lines across where the larkshead has but 1. There is still an area with 1 line, but it is now in a much lower stressed area.

Come on over to Las Vegas, I'll show you sometime.  :)


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: sealcove on September 19, 2010, 03:24 AM
Oops, my bad.  After reading it again I think I see what you mean; you make a larks head with an already formed larks head loop. I don't know what it is called though.

I wish I could get out that way again!  :'(



Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: kitelover on September 19, 2010, 08:21 AM
That larkshead on a larkshead still leaves a section of single line, a little off center now, but still there. Not sure it would increase strength. John, I'm wondering why the Engineer in you hasn't gotten into strength testing rods, knots, etc? It's not the same around here.  :-*


Title: Re: hooking lines to kite .
Post by: thief on September 20, 2010, 04:03 AM
clips also tended to become a weak point destined to break....

in the uk a larks head is also known as a Calf hitch....