GWTW Forum

Kites! Kites! Kites! => Sport Kites => Topic started by: UPNET on April 29, 2009, 07:58 PM



Title: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: UPNET on April 29, 2009, 07:58 PM
Any opinions on these kites? Been flying for four months. Wife and I started on a Cherry Bomb. She now has a Quantum and I have an Acrobatx...with not much air time. I'm thinking either of these would fit the bill. My goal is to learn all the tricks, or at least as many as possible.

Thanks


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: DD on April 29, 2009, 08:13 PM
given the kites you listed as havin, are you looking for a departure from what your flyin? what wind to fly most in? or what wind do you need more fly time in? and lastly which sail pattern do like more?


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: chilese on April 29, 2009, 08:37 PM
DD is  absolutely correct.

For us to suggest a kite begins with you answering a lot of questions.

Typical questions would be:
1 What kites have you flown and enjoyed?
2 What winds do you typically fly in?
3 Have you flown either of the kites you ask us to compare?
4 What is your budget?
5 What sail pattern do you like more?
6 What type of flyer are you?
7 How did you narrow your choice down to these two?

Although the Muse has a simplified layout, you can custom order the colors and play with the colorizer on the Blue Moon site. The Focus Hydra comes in 2 stock color configurations. I don't know if they do customs. You could always call.

I have flown both kites and like both of them. But that doesn't mean you will. The more you tell us, the better we can offer opinions. And that is all they are, opinions. I'm happy to see you supporting the artisan kitemakers. They are a vanishing breed.


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: UPNET on April 30, 2009, 04:08 AM
I guess the main reason would be to get an artisan kite. Since I am new at this I have yet to formulate an opinion on what I like. Started on a Cherry Bomb, but am spending more time with my Acrobatx. Inland flier, in TN. Winds are variable, light to moderate, except when the fronts come in. As an avg. I would say 5-13. But have flown in 15, what a kick that was. I have not flown anything else. Picked these two because they are made in America, although that is not a deal breaker. I want to learn all the tricks.  Like the simplicity of the Muse, but also like the Exile, which would be closer to the Hydra. Budget; would like to keep it under $300. Get something I can advance with. Don't really want to have a houseful of kites.(yeah, right!)
Off topic.....why do I find this so addictive?????    :D


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: Bob D on April 30, 2009, 04:30 AM
I'm not familiar with the Focus Hydra or the Muse but I DO like the Exile. The thing with the Exile is that it's great at speeds below 9ish. At 10 and above it's starts to pull harder and it's a whole lot harder to do tricks. (You'll find that's true about any kite though.) One of the biggest pluses about the Exile is it's really great in lower wind. It will keep flying in lower wind where most standards quit. And it's a very capable kite to do most of the tricks you'd want to learn. If I had to vote, I'd vote for the Exile. It's one of my first choices when I go out and fly.

Another good kite to consider is the Widow Maker. It's got adjustable pig-tails to lengthen and shorten your bridle to adjust for higher or lower winds. The Exile might have the lower wind advantage but the WM can go a bit higher and still be fun.

I've read good things about the Muse and if that's what you're thinking about, you can't go wrong with a Blue Moon Kite. Ken is an amazing craftsman!


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: RobB on April 30, 2009, 04:31 AM
Hey UN...

Addictive ?!? House full of kites ?!? Don't know what you're talking about... :D

I have a Blue Moon Exile and Mantis, and love them both. Ken Mc was a pleasure to deal with, seems like a super guy over the phone, and he builds a great kite. You live close enough that you might end up flying with him at the same festival some day.
Compared to the kites you are currently flying (I have both of those, too.) you are going to notice a jaw dropping difference, no matter what your choice. I've been thinking about getting a Focus kite, myself, but I wanted the Skate for a while now, so that will probably be my first Focus.
Good luck, and accept that you will probably be clearing out a room for your kites, soon.

~Rob.


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: zippy8 on April 30, 2009, 04:46 AM
Like the simplicity of the Muse
Isn't the Muse intended as My First Blue Moon™ ? Seems like a good way to start down the slippery slope of handmade kites.

Mike.


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: Jared on April 30, 2009, 06:00 AM
The Focus Hydra comes in 2 stock color configurations. I don't know if they do customs. You could always call.

They don't have a colorizer on their site, but they are willing to do customs, they're building one for me right now :)


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: DaveH on April 30, 2009, 06:28 AM
If I read it right you're saying you have typical inland winds, leaning toward the lighter side, is that right?  I've never flown a Hydra but have contacted Paul more than once about them.  Looks like a good kite. I own an Exile and have flown a Mantis.  I think I agree with Mike.  The Muse would be a great start.  As said above, any of the kites you mentioned would be a huge step up.  For learning good flying habits and tricks I'm finding myself leaning toward the Muse over the Exile.  For that matter, why not just get a Mantis?  Talk about a kite that will grow with you....
As john said, these are just opinions.  But I think we're all in agreement that buying a Blue Moon is the product of sound judgement.   I've got tons of kites.  My Exile sits proudly in my A bag.  Always will.  Talk to Ken.  You won't be sorry.


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: DavidS on April 30, 2009, 08:50 AM
I recently acquired an Exile, and it was my first "pro/boutique" kite.  Love it.

However, I would not consider the Exile a good beginners kite.  We have a DeepSpace, and someone with basic flying skills can fly the DS (and it will be smoother and more confidence inspiring then anything else I've flown).    Most everyone (especially newbies, but also some flyers with experience) find the Exile to have an odd timing, and therefore more "difficult" to fly - that said, once you have a good basis of advanced tricks, the Exile will allow you to go places you didn't know existed - it will show you flat spins that defy, and rollup with authority.

Bottom line - my Exile sat in my bag for a month+ before I could figure it out (but once I clicked, wow was it great).    DeepSpace offers almost the trick level (and it is far above mere mortal kites), but also is easier to fly.

I flew a Hydra, but didn't have enough time to make a real opinion. Pretty kite, and Paul is a great guy to deal with.

-David


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: fworley on April 30, 2009, 09:10 AM
However, I would not consider the Exile a good beginners kite. ...  Most everyone (especially newbies, but also some flyers with experience) find the Exile to have an odd timing, and therefore more "difficult" to fly - that said, once you have a good basis of advanced tricks, the Exile will allow you to go places you didn't know existed - it will show you flat spins that defy, and rollup with authority.
Thats ^^^ complete nonsense.

The Exile would make a very good beginner kite ... but I'd imagine the Muse would be better yet - forget about weights and yo-yo stoppers and that sh!t ... practice control, precision, landings and flatspins and when you've got all that mastered .. then starting tinkering with the fancy stuff.

-Frazer


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: MtnFlyer on April 30, 2009, 09:55 AM
I'd have to agree with Frazer. To quote kmac himself on the Exile...
Quote
One of the most common comments from my testing team during the Exile's development was about how neutral the kite was. The Exile gives you exactly what you give it.

My first BMK was a Mamba way back when. As stated somewhere in the thread above, I was amazed at the difference in flight. And the construction was and is second to none. Today, the Exile is usually the one I pull out when flying dual lines.

If your goal is to "learn all the tricks", I'd go with the Exile Std for your typical winds. It'll do everything you can do and a whole lot you can't. Trust me on that one. ;)  Upgrade to the Nitro rods if you feel you need that little extra on the upper end. You talked about an "artisan kite". You can never go wrong with a Blue Moon.

Off topic.....why do I find this so addictive?????    :D

LOL   :D   Wait til you try a Blue Moon!  ;)


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: DaveH on April 30, 2009, 10:18 AM
I'm with Mtnflyer and Frazer.  I just want to add, go for the Nitros!  My Exile has Nitros and that solid feel in the frame is really great.  You really do notice the difference. The Muse, or as I said above Mantis would also be great.  I think I have Mantis on the brain because I flew Mtnflyer's and I still don't have one yet :(  Its a very well balanced, well behaved, comp ready kite.  But the Exile... Dude!  I just had mine out the other day.  The thing rocks!  I fly it all the time.  Its funny, the Exile is so easy to backspin, my first couple the other day were way over rotated because I was pulling to hard. So I was getting like 1 1/2 to two rotations per pull...


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: streamhawk on April 30, 2009, 10:43 AM
can't speak of the Focus, or the Muse either for that matter, but I do own a Exile, and it's become my favorite kite. Since you said you ultimately don't want a housefull of kites, the Exile fills in alot of spaces in a bag. It's low end is amazing for a standard kite, and it has a nice balance of old and new school, does quite flat rotational spin tricks and is capable of whatever you want to throw at it trickwise, well...maybe rolls up a bit slower and wider than some kites, but it's a nice all in one package in my opinion. As far as it being difficult, it's much more forgiving than say a Prism QPro, at least to me.  Plus you can pick your colors. Glad I have one, you probably would be too.

Bill


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: kjdubuque on April 30, 2009, 11:03 AM
I'm just adding to the broken record sound of this thread but another vote for the Exile.  The forward drive is great which makes the bumpy inland winds I have tolerable, as well as a freakishly low end for a standard wind kite.  Take out the weights and I've it up when my "light wind" kites are too much work to keep in the air.  I really wished I would had this kite sooner, would have saved me some cash.

Kris


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: Will Sturdy on April 30, 2009, 11:28 AM
It depends on what you want.

I think you will find the hydra to be much better at modern tricks and easy to learn a lot of stuff on. If you are looking to get into modern tricks it would be better.

The exile is a really nice kite, it is easy to fly and what everyone else said. It would probably be better at learning the basics solidly.

If I was in a position between the two I would definitely go for the hydra, but we probably have different criteria.


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: DaveH on April 30, 2009, 11:29 AM
I noticed you have an Acrobatx.  I've got one too.  I had it out yesterday.  What a scream!  If mine ever totally dies I'll be in touch with Steve for a replacement within minutes.  But the difference you'll find in a full sized sail along the lines of what's been mentioned here will make your trick learning life so much easier.  Just the consistency, hang time, smoothness and stability.  A whole other level.


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: MtnFlyer on April 30, 2009, 11:51 AM
Dave, you flew both the Exile UL and Mantis V2, remember?  :D

(http://inlinethumb17.webshots.com/10448/2679829830064770744S200x200Q85.jpg) (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2679829830064770744YkRjzN) (http://inlinethumb19.webshots.com/43346/2025800610064770744S200x200Q85.jpg) (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2025800610064770744QQyeTX)


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: DaveH on April 30, 2009, 11:59 AM
Boy, do I ever remember!  That was a really great day.  Thanks  :)The one that stuck with me was the Mantis.  That's right, it was a V2.  What I remember is the impeccable balance and refined response.  I've currently got Deep Space fever, but the Mantis is on my list as a must have kite.  I've got a set of wind specific QPs but have been wanting a set of something else.  Could be the Mantis will be it. 


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: mikenchico on April 30, 2009, 01:35 PM
Can't comment on the Focus having never flown thier dual line kites but I have flown the Skate SLK and was bored to tears in comparison to the Blue Moon 61/49.

I do own and will say that either the Exile or the Muse (if you want to save a few $$'s) would fit your needs and I couldn't add anything to the above statements about quality & Ken except more praise. Both are capable kites that I progressed with nicely.

The Skyburner WidowMaker mentioned above is a great kite for learning tricks on though, IMO a bit easier then either of the BMK's. It's a little slower, especially in higher winds and it's nailed while on it's back in a turtle or fade giving you time to get your head together for the next move. And it's been the easiest kite for me to roll up that I've flown when you get to that. Since I'm not good with roll-ups though I haven't tried them on every kite I've tested either.

You definitely won't be disappointed in any Blue Moon Kite and they will take you as far as you can go until somebody invents a radically new kite & tricks. But truthfully I reach for the Widowmaker more often since I am definitely in the Learning category.





Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: Will Sturdy on May 01, 2009, 10:11 AM
"Can't comment on the Focus having never flown thier dual line kites but I have flown the Skate SLK and was bored to tears in comparison to the Blue Moon 61/49."

They are entirely different kites. I would say comparing the skate to the 61/49 is a bit like apples and oranges, but the hydra is a totally different kite from the skate.


Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: moegeo on May 01, 2009, 10:37 AM
Mike, I think if you were to try the Skate indoors you would be very impressed, and absolutely not bored.
Agreed, two totaly different kites.

I flew the Hydra at KP7 and very much liked it. Although I haven't flown the Muze, compaired to the Exile, which I love, similar in feel near their lower wind range but very different as the wind picks up. The Hydra did not seem as prone to increased drive and speed as much as the Exlie.



Title: Re: Blue Moon Muse or Focus Hydra?
Post by: UPNET on May 01, 2009, 04:41 PM
Quote
Isn't the Muse intended as My First Blue Moon™ ? Seems like a good way to start down the slippery slope of handmade kites.

Mike.

I think I see where this is going! ;)

Chris