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Kites! Kites! Kites! => Sport Kites => Topic started by: vigli on September 25, 2011, 12:52 PM



Title: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: vigli on September 25, 2011, 12:52 PM
Hi to all .
One strange question. Does anyone try Saa Devil std and TNT std. by Alpha kite. I know TNT is much newer
It is a bigger kite made for competitions.
But Sea Devil is also made for competition ballet flying very familiar in kite world with good precize flying and tricks
I saw  TNT doing some very fast Jacobs leader on video and wondering is this pilot good tricking practice or kite behavior for doing fast tricks.
Also TNT pilot on video is flying on the longer lines ( I think around 40 meters) and precise flying look much better and more spectacular because it has wide wind window.

Freestyle @ Berck (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsJ_tTyu-AU#)

WOuld the same pilot do same fast tricks on SD too? I know SD is extra good for slow tricks.
Also would precise flying on SD on long lines (40m) look similar as TNT precise flying?
thanks for answer
all best....
smooth winds...


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: obijuankenobe on September 25, 2011, 12:58 PM
First off, the precision flying in this video is not that special.  He is trying to make turns faster than he is capable of making sharp.  His lines are nice, but his corners are sloppy.  He is a great pilot, but he is not showing that with his precision flying here.  Since he's a STACK flier, I am sure he could do much better.  Or maybe he can't do French turns at all.  Who knows?  Personally, one of the best things about the Sea Devil is that it can be wicked precise.

But the Sea Devil can do all these tricks, but it doesn't fall directly into the turtle position as readily, thus making the JL's necessarily a bit slower at max speed. 

Please note that this video is shot in laboratory grade beach winds near sunset.  It doesn't get any better than that. 

But all that said, the pilot in this video is clearly no novice.

obi



Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: Ca Ike on September 25, 2011, 03:40 PM
Mathias can make any kite look that good.  IMO the TNT is a lot better than the Sea Devil and even Lam will tell you his Sea devil isn't his best tricker as he prefers the performance of his Transformer (a more updated design).  I don't have a lot of line time on a TNT but it is a sweet kite and will trick how you want it to its a very responsive kite.  DEnny or KingJ can tell you more since they have them but my choice of the two would be a TNT hands down.


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: vigli on September 26, 2011, 01:16 AM
Obi
please can You explain me You words:
Personally, one of the best things about the Sea Devil is that it can be wicked precise.
""wicked precise"" ???words are confusing me-what does it mean!?.
thanks
I read that SD is made for competition precise flying and for tricks too...
So SD would be in polyvalent kite category (precise and trick)?
Not just in pure trick category like some other pure trick kite (Gem, DS..)
Am I right?
thanks
boris


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: RobB on September 26, 2011, 04:47 AM
Hey Boris...
I have a couple of Sea Devils, so maybe I can answer part of this question... I would imagine that the pilot in the video could fly a Sea Devil just about the same, if not better as far as the figure flying. Some kites cut better corners than others, no doubt. The Sea Devils are not the best corner-cutters in my bag, but they're not bad. I can see the pilot in the video has some good skills, and have to assume the TNT isn't the most precise kite, or the pilot wasn't trying at all.
~Rob.


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: Ca Ike on September 26, 2011, 04:59 AM
Hey Boris...
I have a couple of Sea Devils, so maybe I can answer part of this question... I would imagine that the pilot in the video could fly a Sea Devil just about the same, if not better as far as the figure flying. Some kites cut better corners than others, no doubt. The Sea Devils are not the best corner-cutters in my bag, but they're not bad. I can see the pilot in the video has some good skills, and have to assume the TNT isn't the most precise kite, or the pilot wasn't trying at all.
~Rob.
Incase you guys aren't realizing it the pilot in that video is Mathias Hack, the designer. ROb your right he wasn't really trying to do precision but showcase the TNT's freestyle ability. In the one part he was doing precision its a side view and you can't really see it.  THe TnT is quite precise but as I said I don't have a lot of line time on one and I know I can't do the kite justice.


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: obijuankenobe on September 26, 2011, 05:20 AM
I think the Sea Devil can be very (wicked) precise.  It does very nice corners, and holds lines pretty well. 

It looks to me as though the TNT has just a bit more oversteer than the SD's, and that is probably what makes the corners look just a bit sloppy to my eye. 

But if you want tricks, there is no question that the TNT is a generation ahead of the SD.  The SD taz machines are there, but require some very precise commands.  And the lack of a locked in turtle just requires more attention on the part of the pilot than if you can pop it back and forget about it coming out. 

I just want to clarify that I wasn't saying that the TNT cannot be precise.  I honestly don't know.  But from that video, I wouldn't assume it was better at precision flying than the SD.  That's all.

obi


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: ezme6 on September 26, 2011, 05:58 AM
Just get a Lam Hoac Transformer, precise and tricky. I was shocked how well the kite tracked and turned, better than my Sea Devils and Fearless kites. Transformer price is not bad either... 8)


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: emegaz on September 26, 2011, 06:18 AM
Quote
Transformer price is not bad either...


Are u serious?


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: DWayne on September 26, 2011, 06:21 AM
I can see the pilot in the video has some good skills, and have to assume the TNT isn't the most precise kite

I would assume a kite that's won as many comps as the TNT has, to have more than a little bit of precision built into it.
I've never flown a Sea Devil so I can't offer any insight into any real differences in the two kites.

Denny


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: DWayne on September 26, 2011, 06:23 AM
Quote
Transformer price is not bad either...


Are u serious?

A Transformer is a lot cheaper than a Fearless or a TNT.  ;)

Denny


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: emegaz on September 26, 2011, 06:30 AM
I can still do everything that the TNT did in that vid on lower priced kites.


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: vigli on September 26, 2011, 06:52 AM
yes, Trans. it is a cheeper--- but it is a little smaller too, with deeper sail... I'm sure it trick extra good...
But ........... I enjoy  in SD size, with more sail on it with  solid pull....
I like to feel kite in my hands....and better connection with kite...
I have Gemini (with all respect) and it is simply  to hard to fly for me- smaller size then SD, too fast for me. Veryy offen I can't do on Gem what I won a do. And very light on lines. I gess not my stille but very nice design and so popular...
But SD for my skills and my ability to fly is very nice and  very predictable. You can trick it slow, You can trick it faster   ;)
and always nice solid moderate pull no matter how strong wind  blow...


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: DWayne on September 26, 2011, 07:04 AM
I can still do everything that the TNT did in that vid on lower priced kites.

That's great. Its not about how much money you spend. Its about how much fun you have.  ;)

Denny


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: obijuankenobe on September 26, 2011, 12:10 PM
I would assume a kite that's won as many comps as the TNT has, to have more than a little bit of precision built into it.
I've never flown a Sea Devil so I can't offer any insight into any real differences in the two kites.

Denny

What competitions have been won using the TNT?  STACK competitions or TP's?

Just curious, as I actually don't know.  But if it's TP's...precision don't mean diddly. 

obi


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: DWayne on September 26, 2011, 01:05 PM

What competitions have been won using the TNT?  STACK competitions or TP's? 

TP comps for sure.

Quote
if it's TP's...precision don't mean diddly. 

Sloppy entrances, sloppy tricks, and sloppy exits, don't win comps so I disagree here.

Denny


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: obijuankenobe on September 26, 2011, 01:20 PM
Sloppy corners and sloppy lines don't contribute much to scoring in TP.

If you stop in a STACK contest to unwind you lines, you'll lose.  If you do that in a TP, you lose NOTHING. 

That's just a minor example.  In TP, the scoring system ignores between tricks flying almost completely.

obi


Title: Re: TNT:Sea Devil
Post by: tpatter on September 26, 2011, 05:54 PM
If you like the SD, you should try the Trans. It is smaller, but I find it shares none of the negative traits typical of smaller kites.