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Kites! Kites! Kites! => Sport Kites => Topic started by: vigli on September 27, 2011, 03:46 AM



Title: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: vigli on September 27, 2011, 03:46 AM
Hi to all
I know we all have some favorite kite which is best connect to our flying stile and way how we tricks.
For me it is Sea Devil
Is there any kite similar to SD (which can easy flick-flack without dead spots, good precision, to keep looooooong and stabile fade, ability to fly in low wind, easy to yo-yos, very easy to cascade, ready for slow and fast tricks, very predictable ...).
So much think are good about SD.
I know You will say: Fearless and Transformer can repleace SD.
But Fearless has little different touch and need to teach it and Transformer is tricky  but NOT Sea Devil size.
I think Lams kite are unique with unique feel.
Very good combination:
Extra good kite + extra good bridle= extra nice ability to fly
So does only Lamís kite has that specific kind of unique feel as SD has. If answer is ""yes"" than the only replacement for the Sea Devil would be again only  kite from Lam''s kite familly or I''m wrong. SD is kite from 2005. Does exist kite similar to SD but update version in kiteís world?
The unique SD feel is only connect with Lam's kite stile?

Maybe You can help me to answer this question because I didnít have chance to fly other kites and to compare them with SD.
Thanks to all for Your thinking
Smooth Wind


boris


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: Bob D on September 27, 2011, 04:08 AM
I tried a SD once and I thought it was quirkier than my Deep Space or my Widow Maker. The DS is a little harder to turtle and lazy susan but it's a trait you have to learn to deal with. It cascades beautifully and will lock into a fade and it's not hard to yoyo following Tim Benson's T&T tutorial. The WM is just an all around easy kite to fly. Both are great, IMHO. Generally, it seems that almost any kite in the upper price range will be no brainers.


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: RobB on September 27, 2011, 04:30 AM
If you're looking for a predictable, neutral kite that can do most or all of the tricks... try a Widow Maker. I have 2 Sea Devils, a standard and a light, so I'm familiar with how good they are. I also have two Fearless, but they're nothing like the Sea Devil. It took me 30-50 hours on the lines to get used to the Fearless after flying the Sea Devil for 2 years. I don't know if I ever really got used to them, and don't really miss the one that's been broken for months.
Actually, both my Sea Devils have been on the repair pile for close to a year also. The Widow Maker has filled the gap left by both of them with one kite. The standard WM flies in almost as low winds as the SD light, and I can fly it right up to 15mph, where I stop flying dual-lines anyway.
If you enjoy and get along with  the SD, you'll be able to fly the WM right out of the bag, the first flight. No time wasted getting used to a quirky kite, just fly & enjoy. The WM also can make some nice straight lines and sharp corners... not the best, but pretty good.
~Rob.


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: THE ONE on September 27, 2011, 05:25 AM
Quote
The Widow Maker has filled the gap left by both of them with one kite

I noticed you have mantioned a WM, I own a Widow by Premier and have a question. If WM and W are vertualy the same design (I understand that materials used to make the kite are different), are you experiencing oversteer issues with WM, my W in lighter winds oversteers a lot. Any advise?


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: adx1592 on September 27, 2011, 05:38 AM
take the weight out, try powering out of turns to control the extra mass, move more. Give that a shot and see what helps. I've only flown the Widow from Premier in lower winds and have had no issues with oversteer?


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: THE ONE on September 27, 2011, 06:06 AM
I usually add the weight while flying in stronger winds, it seems it is working for me. Probably a stupid question but can you explain in more detail
Quote
try powering out of turns to control the extra mass


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: adx1592 on September 27, 2011, 06:22 AM
yes but we'll have to do it in a PM- dont want to hijack the thread.

Boris, I'd give a WidowMaker a shot for sure. A fantastic kite and super easy to get in touch with. If you'd like something maybe a little smaller and more fast paced, I'd also try and Ocius. I'd also suggest the Solus but I'll let more people speak of that when more kites get moving as well. Maybe try some searching on youtube to see what kind of kites in the vidos you THINK you might like, and make a list- then narrow it down, etc.


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: tpatter on September 27, 2011, 09:35 AM
If the SD works so well for you, why not just stick with it?  It's an amazing kite and plenty of folks are doing mad tricks with kites than are MUCH older in design. 

Personally, I much prefer the SD to the WM, but certainly try it for yourself.  I think you are correct in that Lams kites have a unique feel - all the best kites that I've tried do.  I like kites that do most everything well and excel in a few areas.






Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: vigli on September 27, 2011, 10:45 AM
Hi Tpatter
You said:"" It's an amazing kite and plenty of folks are doing mad tricks with kites than are MUCH older in design.""
You mean that older design as SD are doing plenty of tricks as new design kites? 
I'm I correct? Did I understand You good?
thanks



Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: tpatter on September 27, 2011, 12:11 PM
Hi Tpatter
You said:"" It's an amazing kite and plenty of folks are doing mad tricks with kites than are MUCH older in design.""
You mean that older design as SD are doing plenty of tricks as new design kites? 
I'm I correct? Did I understand You good?
thanks



Yeah, I am saying, aside from perhaps a more fringe kite-design specific trick like a riser, it does everything anything else does and most things really really well.  It also may not Taz as easily as a TNT, but it will certainly Taz to a reasonable degree.




Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: obijuankenobe on September 27, 2011, 01:43 PM
Here are some SD taz machines from north of the Arctic Circle:

Svalbard stunt kite sighting (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWJDKSNkeOA#)

Start the video at about 1 minute (to avoid the amateurish sped up clip in the beginning).  I was really just starting to rock this trick when I shot this footage.  The rest of the video is pretty weak.  But the taz machines, at least some of them, are pretty tight.

Damn, the SD is a great kite.  I know you are curious, but if you like 'em...stick with 'em. 

I think the suggestion from Rob, because he too has flown SD's, is probably a good one...Widow Maker.  I get along well with the Transfers (prefer the big one), as well as the Nirvana and the elusive Vendetta. 

obi


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: obijuankenobe on September 27, 2011, 02:07 PM
Oh yeah, I forgot to add...you need a LIGHT.

The light is framed in 3PT and is Icarex (assuming you have a nylon standard).

The kite in the above video is such a Light, and it is easily the best SD I have flown.  Wind range is great on the low end, and is slightly overpowered around when the standard really grooves.  A perfect 2nd SD, which will end up being your primary kite.

obi


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: vigli on September 28, 2011, 03:40 AM
thanks a lot Obi for advice.
I have 2 standard Sea Devil. They are bouth std.
BUT !!! one is heavy the other one is light standard.
One is made with nylon and other with Icarex.
Nylon version is 20 grams heavier and weight distribution is different. They fly the same but nylon version has little bit more inertia I think and need slightly more wind.
Icarex version has less weight it is more floaty and slightly different in cascade. I think Icarex version teach me even better doing technic of cascade (second pop in cascade)...
But I like that LITTLE difference between 2 modelsAnd just to say-white kites look so nice on the blue sky. They just shine....
all best
boris

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Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: vigli on September 28, 2011, 03:41 AM
thanks Tpatter
ohhh yesss I'm more then a stick to SD. I was just wondering similarity SD with other kites
I have a plenty of stuff to learn with it.   
You said ""a more fringe kite-design specific trick like a riser""
Is ""riser"" a rising a kite in the turtle position???
thanks

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Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: KaoS on September 28, 2011, 06:48 PM
I had a standard Sea Devil for years and LOVED it.  I only sold it when someone offered me too much money.

I have a Widowmaker (LOVE this one too!) and would have to say it has a similar way of behaving.  It is very well balanced, very neutral (no quirks that put it significantly apart from other tricksters), and rewards learners and competent flyers equally.  Build quality is top!  Great sewing by Heads Up, fantastic framing and finish from Jon Trennepohl.

I did have a Fearless for a short while.  The behaviour was sufficiently different from the Sea Devil for me to never really gel with it, but that is a personal thing, not a reflection on the kite.  First time I flew the Widowmaker I was able to do all the stuff I usually do, plus have the confidence in the kite to progress to other tricks.

Well worth considering.


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: JimB on September 28, 2011, 09:08 PM
Yes. A rising turtle.


Is ""riser"" a rising a kite in the turtle position???
thanks


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: vigli on September 29, 2011, 01:42 AM
thanks a lot friends.
I will stick to SD.
I think I will progress more in process of kite-trick learning  with not mixing with other kites .

all best....
here is my sweety with SD
 ;)

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Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: Dolphinboy on September 29, 2011, 11:06 PM
thanks a lot friends.
I will stick to SD.
I think I will progress more in process of kite-trick learning  with not mixing with other kites .

all best....
here is my sweety with SD
 ;)

I actually think that trying different kites helped me learn new tricks. Certain tricks are just easier to "get" on different kites and then you can go back and hit them on the previous kite. It's like a miracle, well maybe not a miracle ;) but it worked for me.

I'll still swap to a different kite and it still seems to help when I'm stuck on something. That being said, I switch less kites than I used to but I still keep something different in the bag in case I need to shake things up. I also just like a change from time to time.

If you like the SD and ever feel like a bit of a change, get a Fearless or Transformer. They are both excellent kites and share that Lam magic with the SD. (only better)


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: vigli on September 30, 2011, 12:30 AM
I understand You what You wont to say.
Some kites are better for some tricks then is good to change.
Pitty here were are live wind is not constant like the places next to sea.
So when I go out to fly, that little time I like to use on the kite which I enjoy more and kite which I can control good and to go home with smile .I I pick kite which work for me the best to spend best time.
There is a lot of kite on market which are look so good, on You tube they fly so good.
I can take it but ....let say.....if it can't hold fade so long as SD kite then is not good for me... and I think newer kite are very pichy long standoffs and stabile fade could be a problem- designers work to get roll up kite not a fade kite. Every kite has ability more for some tricks more or less. Very easy I could be dissapoint...

SD cover a lot of thing and that way I fly it.
I like fade so much.....but long fade.... This year I spend a lot of time on the fade. 5minute in fade for SD is not a problem in good wind. It sleep in that position  . It looks as magic
..
I'm sure number of kites are great. It would be good just to try one kite some kite festival just for a few minutes and I will know is it good for me.
But no festival here...and only I fly stunt kite in my country.
Let say K2 kite, look  very nice, it is expensive as all good kite  but it could be very frustrating to buy new kite and not to fit with it. Let start from bridle it is different then SD and trickabilty will be different I'm sure.....Invictus is very nice, Cosmic, DS, Seven..... no end of list..., lovely....BUT ....... We are talking about finnese and maybe big difference...
It is best to try before pick new kite if You can offcourse.. I never try before buying because didn't had a chance,but I was lucky when I  order SD. :)
With the other hand I fly other kite too. I like my ELixir very much-old school but very nice, I have Fearless SUL,E2, UFO SUL,Alien,Trick Tail.Gem  and some other kites.
Let say Gem-very nice kite- but very fast trick for me!!! I have to learn extra  good SD to be good on Gem-just my thinking. It is hard for me with Gem.
So I'm not only  on SD. But things which I learn on SD I can  pass to other my kites. With the other words SD is my teacher.
SD teach me very nice cascade which I use for UFO sul.
all best


Title: Re: Sea Devil Std.
Post by: Dolphinboy on September 30, 2011, 02:24 PM
You have a good selection of kites. Enough to go a long way before you would out grow them (if ever) and they are different styles which is what I was referring to in the above post.

The Gem is not the best in shifty inland winds so switch to it when the wind is smoother and you'll be much happier with it. Fun kite, backspins like crazy. I love the Fearless SUL too but only in real light wind where it's lack of mass isn't a problem, so say 1 to 4-5mph or so. It will handle OK in inlands winds, better than many others. Some have struggled a little getting used to it but I never did. From the moment I first flew it I tricked it like I'd flown it for months, I wanted one. It Fades OK but not locked on like the SD. But it will trick sweet in light wind so use it in those conditions and it'll serve you well.

Peace