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Kites! Kites! Kites! => Beginners Corner => Topic started by: KSC on April 26, 2012, 07:17 PM



Title: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 26, 2012, 07:17 PM
Look into my eyes...  ???

(http://i48.tinypic.com/20b200o.jpg)

Big thanks to Steve for making my first (of many) kite purchase a great one!

First impressions, it's BIG and much lighter than I expected! Carbon fiber I'm familiar with, but having never handled a real kite before, the thinness of the sail really surprised me.
I guess maybe I expected something more "heavy-duty", like a parka or umbrellaish type material, not so much a crinkly paper-like nylony stuff... Thankfully it's not what I had in mind or it probably wouldn't be leaving the ground any time soon.

Anyway, I was able to put it together without too much trouble, but there were a few awkward spots. I'm always paranoid I'm going to break something, and It felt like I was forcing things that shouldn't be forced. There were a few times when I feared I might rip the whole thing in half, but now that it's together, I can see all that tension is essential to the shape of the kite.

It may take a few days before I can get to a beach/park, so in the meantime I've been watching a bunch of videos and I've come up with a few questions if you guys don't mind?

-Are the bridal clips really necessary? It seems like having metal next to thin nylon has potential for some trouble. Should I take those off and use a larks, or do you think it's best that I leave them on there for a while until I know what I'm doing? Am I just being paranoid?

-I feel like there's stress against the black part of the sail where the leading edge connects. It's fine in this pic, but when the kite was fully assembled yesterday, the sail was much closer to the connector on one side, almost like it was crimped in there a little. Is that something to be mindful of? How strong is the sail material?

(http://i48.tinypic.com/2af0cxt.jpg)
 
-When folding the kite back up, (I should have paid attention when unfolding it the first time) I feel like the standoffs are in my way. I'm afraid I'm going to bend them. Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but when I get to the last stage, I cant seem to wrap it up tight enough...

(http://i50.tinypic.com/bfmmxd.jpg)

Is there a "technique" I should know about or am I just being paranoid?

-The Prism dvd mentions many times that the best way to practice is with a 20' foot set of lines. Is that something I should look into getting? 

Well, that's it for now. I'm sure I'll have BUNCH more questions when I actually get it out of the kitchen!  :D

Thanks, guys.



Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: B-13 on April 26, 2012, 09:32 PM
Look into my eyes...  ???

([url]http://i48.tinypic.com/20b200o.jpg[/url])

Big thanks to Steve for making my first (of many) kite purchase a great one!

First impressions, it's BIG and much lighter than I expected! Carbon fiber I'm familiar with, but having never handled a real kite before, the thinness of the sail really surprised me.
I guess maybe I expected something more "heavy-duty", like a parka or umbrellaish type material, not so much a crinkly paper-like nylony stuff... Thankfully it's not what I had in mind or it probably wouldn't be leaving the ground any time soon.

Anyway, I was able to put it together without too much trouble, but there were a few awkward spots. I'm always paranoid I'm going to break something, and It felt like I was forcing things that shouldn't be forced. There were a few times when I feared I might rip the whole thing in half, but now that it's together, I can see all that tension is essential to the shape of the kite.

It may take a few days before I can get to a beach/park, so in the meantime I've been watching a bunch of videos and I've come up with a few questions if you guys don't mind?

-Are the bridal clips really necessary? It seems like having metal next to thin nylon has potential for some trouble. Should I take those off and use a larks, or do you think it's best that I leave them on there for a while until I know what I'm doing? Am I just being paranoid?

Get rid of them as soon as you can! Cut the heat shrink care fully and then slide the clip off the bridle. You will find your way as you cut the heat shrink off. The clips are snag points and a dangerous weapon for the sail. Snags?? You will perhaps not find this today but with time and with some slack tricks, you will get your lines or even the bridle itself snag somewhere.


-I feel like there's stress against the black part of the sail where the leading edge connects. It's fine in this pic, but when the kite was fully assembled yesterday, the sail was much closer to the connector on one side, almost like it was crimped in there a little. Is that something to be mindful of? How strong is the sail material?

Sail material is as strong as you will take care of it :) flying in the rain will not affect it but packing it damped and moist will surely have some effect with time. Flying at the beach is great but make sure to get rid of the sand and dirt after flying. I carry a soft nylon brush with me. I say SOFT as brushing the sail can damage the coating too.The mylar part is to be taken care as folding it same spot with time can make cracks in it. Other wise the plastic ferrule is soft and will no damage the sail. You can see it rubbing on the ground but things get different in flight

([url]http://i48.tinypic.com/2af0cxt.jpg[/url])
 
-When folding the kite back up, (I should have paid attention when unfolding it the first time) I feel like the standoffs are in my way. I'm afraid I'm going to bend them. Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but when I get to the last stage, I cant seem to wrap it up tight enough...

You will never fold it back as it was before. Forget this. The hypnotist is a tough kite and the sail is really tough too. Is you can get your hands on a long sleeve, buy one. Steve got the nice Prism sleeve here. Thus you leave your kite long and just slide it in the sleeve. LE connected and thus limiting stress and damage from accidental folding and un-folding process. Untighting the LE end bungees which will get loose with time.If you want to fold it as it was factory, don't forget that it was there for weeks, months before getting to you and this time spent in the package made it even more tight. So don't worry about this and just fold it without creasing the mylar and sail with standoffs and bridles inside the sail.

([url]http://i50.tinypic.com/bfmmxd.jpg[/url])

Is there a "technique" I should know about or am I just being paranoid?
Technique will come with time and being paranoid with a new toy is something normal here LOL. Just remember to have fun and care only not to break it while flying. As long it is on the ground nothing can hurt it. Apart wild dogs, walking on the spars or just wrongly setup up from the beginning.

-The Prism dvd mentions many times that the best way to practice is with a 20' foot set of lines. Is that something I should look into getting? 

20' lines are for light winds and recovery practice where the pilots can see the lines and any snag points and un wrap the lines easily. This is an option but if you are new to duals, then you should find this as it will help you understand some aspect of the kite and wraps. Also shorter lines will make the kite react more rapidly but this is not meant for flying IMHO. Just for ground works.

Well, that's it for now. I'm sure I'll have BUNCH more questions when I actually get it out of the kitchen!  :D

Get them here :) More are to drop some more lines in what i said and more experienced pilots here will bring their thoughts to help you.

Thanks, guys.




There are many things to say about the hypnotist but with time you will discover them yourself and will ask your questions again. One thing i can say right is add some c-clips or APA stoppers at the LE connectors as i noticed they are not present on the Hypno and this will damage the sail with time.
Mail me and i get you some photos to know what am talking about.

Ohh, i forgot...Welcome to the beautiful world of kiting :)

B


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: ko on April 26, 2012, 09:43 PM
If you can get to a beach were the wind blows off of the ocean,it will be way easier to learn than flying in a park with obstructions that mess with the wind.As for the rest GO FLY IT and have fun! I have a quantum that has had the bridle clips on it for years. so again GO FLY


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 28, 2012, 11:08 AM
Awesome! Thanks for the detailed reply, B-13! I really appreciate the insight. I'll touch on a few points when I get home from my first day of flying! :D

ko, I'm actually standing on the beach as I type this. I've been at it for over an hour or so and having a real blast. Thankfully the Hypno came as advertised as she's taking a REAL beating'! I'll post a few videos later, so everyone can have a good laugh.  :D


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: Ca Ike on April 28, 2012, 02:50 PM
Welcome to the addiction KSC.  FIrst suggestion is get yourself a full length sleeve as faily quickly you will do like the rest of us and leave the leading edges assembled.  Second, get rid of the clips as they can bend and the larks head is more secore anyway.  As for packing it up in the prism bag here's what you can do.

1. Fold the leading edged along themsselves, like you do already.

2. bring the rods nest to the spine under the center T making sure the bridle is inside the wing.

3 WHile holding the rods in one hand, find the center of the fold for one wing, tuck the standoffs inside the folded wing and start rolling it up tight.  Make sure you move the standoffs as needed to keep them parallel to the roll and continue rolling up to the spine.  Do not roll the sail around the spine.  I have seen more kites damaged by the fittings when you do.

4 Repeat for other wing and put on the keeper strap.

Prism pretty much packs them this way.

Also, if you let us know where your located there might be some local fliers you can meet up with for some hands on help.


Anthony


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 28, 2012, 05:59 PM

Get rid of them as soon as you can...

I thought so. I definitely will. Admittedly, I did fly with them on today, as I decided at the last minute to head out to the beach and when I got there was pretty impatient to get started. I didn't want to risk messing anything up after driving an hour and half.
 
Quote
Flying at the beach is great but make sure to get rid of the sand and dirt after flying. I carry a soft nylon brush with me. I say SOFT as brushing the sail can damage the coating too.The mylar part is to be taken care as folding it same spot with time can make cracks in it. Other wise the plastic ferrule is soft and will no damage the sail. You can see it rubbing on the ground but things get different in flight

Good idea. While I was packing up today I took extra care to shake everything out really well, but there was still some small grains of sand lodged inside the stitching of the sail as well as the fittings. I soft brush would be great for this.

Quote
Thus you leave your kite long and just slide it in the sleeve. LE connected and thus limiting stress and damage from accidental folding and un-folding process. Untighting the LE end bungees which will get loose with time.If you want to fold it as it was factory, don't forget that it was there for weeks, months before getting to you and this time spent in the package made it even more tight. So don't worry about this and just fold it without creasing the mylar and sail with standoffs and bridles inside the sail.

You know, attaching the leading edges was actually one of the parts that freaked me out the most when I first put the kite together. I'm still not 100% comfortable doing it. If buying a long bag will not only give me the extra space I need, but also provide me with an excuse to leave the LEs together, consider it bought! LOL

Quote
Apart wild dogs, walking on the spars or just wrongly setup up from the beginning.

That would be just my kind of luck! Assemble the kite, attach my lines, as I'm walking back to my straps, a pack wild dogs just come out of nowhere and attack my kite!  :D
 
Quote
20' lines are for light winds and recovery practice where the pilots can see the lines and any snag points and un wrap the lines easily. This is an option but if you are new to duals, then you should find this as it will help you understand some aspect of the kite and wraps. Also shorter lines will make the kite react more rapidly but this is not meant for flying IMHO. Just for ground works.

Cool. I'll just do what everyone else does and make them from a broken set of lines in the future.

Thanks again for all your help.


-----------------


Welcome to the addiction KSC.

Thanks, man. It's been awesome so far.

Quote
FIrst suggestion is get yourself a full length sleeve as faily quickly you will do like the rest of us and leave the leading edges assembled.  Second, get rid of the clips as they can bend and the larks head is more secore anyway.

Cool. Both of these are on my immediate to do list.

Quote
As for packing it up in the prism bag here's what you can do...

This worked MUCH better. The standoffs definitely weren't as much in the way as before. I wasn't able to get it back as tight as Prism, but it was a hell of a lot better than the "umbrella" wrap I had before. Thank you.

Quote
Also, if you let us know where your located there might be some local fliers you can meet up with for some hands on help.

I'm in Northern NJ about 15 miles from NYC. Besides braving the local parks, I'll probably being doing the majority of my flying in Sandy Hook or near my in-laws in Suffolk LI.


 


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: RobB on April 28, 2012, 08:02 PM
Let me know if you want to fly some kites when you're out on the Island. Also, take some time to check out Liberty State Park, lots of people fly there, and it shouldn't be too far from you.


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 28, 2012, 08:58 PM
I had heard about Liberty State Park being a hot spot. I was actually going to go there to save on driving, but I feared there might be too many people around. I'm kinda self-conscious when it comes to learning new things, so If given the opportunity, I'd much prefer not having anyone gawkin' at me. ya know? Pre-Memorial Day shore, on the other hand, was practically desolate. Too bad the summer is gonna change all that.  :D

I'd love to get together some time on the Island. I've always wished for an excuse to ditch out on visiting my Mother-in-law, now I have one! Which beaches do you frequent? Are you in Nassau or Suffolk?

As far as today was concerned, I think it went fairly well. I did spend a good amount of time testing the integrity of the kite's nose, walking the 85' dash, and trying to keep the kite on it's back long enough for me to make it back to the straps, but when I was actually air born, I was able to keep it there for a decent length of time before crash landing.

I didn't really attempt anything too fancy, I just did a lot of wind window exploring while trying to keep the kite in the sky for as long as possible. Generally, the kite went where I wanted it to, oddly enough the majority of my crashes were on attempts to do a simple loop. Now I'm under the impression that this is like the easiest "trick" in the book, yet I couldn't seem to get out of the spin before it went wild and smashed back to earth. Other than that, the only thing that actually frustrated me was the inability to keep the kite down after taking the walk of shame and setting it back into launch position. Thankfully, being on the beach I could throw a handful of sand on the sail (probably not a good idea, but I saw someone doing it in a video), but I can't imagine what to do in a park if this were to happen.

Thankfully I didn't break anything, but I sure did give the LE sleeve a beating...

(http://i46.tinypic.com/i3c3cy.jpg)

All in all it was an amazing day. My family and I had a lot of fun flying, gathering shells, and just hanging out. This may sound odd to most of you, but I'm not really an outdoorsy guy. You can literally count on one hand the number of times I've actually set foot on a beach in the past decade, but for some reason I was compelled to try this. My daughter and I had such a great time flying a dollar store kite a few weekends ago at the park, that I decided to come online later that day to find us an upgrade. Well, one thing led to another and here I am with a stunt kite spending my weekend on a beach of all places. Looks like that number is going to double before the summer even starts.  ;D


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: ko on April 28, 2012, 09:43 PM
A little ca will fix that right up. just make sure you dont glue it to the spar. as for dashing back to your kite,at least at the beach toss a little sand on the trailing edge. This will keep it grounded and you breathing a little easier. Welcome to the club
Kurt PS>http://prismkites.com/lounge-training.php (http://prismkites.com/lounge-training.php)


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 29, 2012, 05:10 AM
Is regular old Krazy Glue okay or should I order a more industrial grade online? There seems to be a hundred different kinds, any suggestions for the best brand/formula to have or are they all pretty much the same?

The sand thing is okay then? The part of the beach I was on was a little on the gritty side. Lots of tiny rocks and shell fragments mixed in. I was afraid it might damage the sail. I did it anyway as it was better than a face full of kite, but I wasn't happy about it.


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: RobB on April 29, 2012, 05:29 AM
You're going to have to try really hard to damage your sail with beach sand. You are going to need a kite stake, and old screwdriver works for me. That will keep the kite from getting out of hand. If you don't have a stake with you, roll the kite from take-off position back, around, so the nose points upwind and the lines come out at the trailing edge, and over the top of the kite towards you. It won't take off in that position, and when you get back to the handles, just walk back a few steps, and the kite will roll over into take off position. This method is easiest in winds under 15mph. Hopefully someone has a picture of this, it's easier than it sounds.
Good luck !



Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 29, 2012, 07:00 AM
Ah, so don't just turn the kite 180 degrees, but have the lines actually underneath it and coming back over?

And when you mean a kite stake, you don't mean for the straps, but the kite itself? Where do you secure it?

I totally forgot to bring anything with me for the straps, but I was able to improvise...

(http://i48.tinypic.com/11j0ide.jpg)


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: cerfvoliste on April 29, 2012, 07:07 AM
HI! Welcome -

If you become a frequent flyer, I suggest getting a full length kite bag (sleeve)  and leaving the leading edges connected.

As far as the clips go, it is a toss up. I eventually cut mine off and used a "Larks-Head" but there is reall no down side to leaving the clips on, I just think it is quicker to us the knot.

Don't worry to much about wear and tear, kites are sportintg equipment and do wear out. I get some "insignia" or "gaffers" tape and reinforce wear spots.

A paint brush is a good item to use for knocking sand off your kite before packing up. When it gets really bad, I just take it in the shower with me.

Have Fun
CV


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 29, 2012, 07:52 AM
I'm looking at bags now. I'd like to go for the roll-up Prism bag, but I'm thinking maybe the Speed bag is big enough for my needs...for now. Mostly it will come down to cost, so long as the Speed bag is only smaller in width and full sized in length, I think that's probably my best bet.

As far as repair tapes are concerned, is it a good idea to just go ahead and get the Prism repair kit, or should I just get rolls of tape separately?

Thanks for the welcome.  :)


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: madhabitz on April 29, 2012, 11:10 AM
I'm looking at bags now. I'd like to go for the roll-up Prism bag, but I'm thinking maybe the Speed bag is big enough for my needs...for now. Mostly it will come down to cost, so long as the Speed bag is only smaller in width and full sized in length, I think that's probably my best bet.

Kite bags have a cool-factor, that's for sure. If you've got more than one kite and set of lines, they become a must-have that you'll be able to justify (heh). The thing is, what these guys are talking about is a full length kite sleeve. That'll save you a ton of money right now. You can get them for as low as $4, but our forum host (Steve) has a really nice one for $14 here: Prism Kite Sleeve (http://www.chicokites.com/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=263)

Quote
That would be just my kind of luck! Assemble the kite, attach my lines, as I'm walking back to my straps, a pack wild dogs just come out of nowhere and attack my kite! 

It's not just dogs you have to worry over -- gotta watch out for four year old little boys who escape their parent's watch. Deadly.

The Hypnotist is a really good kite to start with-- it's a little heavy, but can fly a large range of wind, especially if it's a nice steady wind. If you do get a chance to fly with Rob, *do* it!! Watching his videos and reading his posts, you'll be able to see that he seems like a heck of a nice guy who knows a ton about this stuff and would be generous with his skills and knowledge. He also seems to have a huge bag of kites for you to drool over.

The short lines are what helped me the most in the early stages. I was able to see where my lines were and The Walk isn't nearly as long..... which is important when you spend as much time on the ground as I did. After awhile, I realized I could feel where I was snagged and can almost always fix things without having to make The Walk.

Have fun with this flying-thing. It's awesome!

Nancy


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: B-13 on April 29, 2012, 11:11 AM
KSC, you are having fun then :)

to avoid tears and wears on your kite right now in the beginners level, do not rub or slide your kite on the sand if it is on it's back (nose away from flier) just put it in launch position and tug on the line un-even to you to make it square rather than trying to make it square to you when it is leaning on its back. This will keep your trailing edge from wearing too soon and protect the back of the kite/sail too.
For trailing edge, do not attempt to fly the kite when you crashed with leading edge on the ground. Unless you are on hard sand and know this recovery method. in the Prism DVD it shows you how to launch in this position, but he is doing it on hard sand and not the corals and crushed shells you have there.
I used Insigna tape myself (bought from Steve here) and it works really well.
Then an important rule for beginners is to give maximum slack to the kite when diving towards the ground. If you need to run, jump forward like a goal keeper, DO IT! Lol this will save you additional expenses in repairs and avoid frustrations :)
Then if winds are too high, better keep the kite in the bag and play another game with the kids..i know what it is when you have been bitten by the kite bug but it's not worth it damaging a new kite for this :)

As for the bag, get you the sleeve for now and when you reach +3 kites, then you can look into a kite bag..for now save your bucks for another kite....you will soon want another one ;)

B


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 29, 2012, 01:38 PM
Kite bags have a cool-factor, that's for sure. If you've got more than one kite and set of lines, they become a must-have that you'll be able to justify (heh). The thing is, what these guys are talking about is a full length kite sleeve. That'll save you a ton of money right now. You can get them for as low as $4, but our forum host (Steve) has a really nice one for $14 here: Prism Kite Sleeve ([url]http://www.chicokites.com/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=263[/url])


Ah, okay. Let me ask this, though. Do most of you guys with kite bags have the kites inside the bag also individually sleeved? In other words, would buying sleeves become redundant when you finally do get a bag?

Quote
It's not just dogs you have to worry over -- gotta watch out for four year old little boys who escape their parent's watch. Deadly.


Ha! Yeah, I tried the park out today. There wasn't enough wind, so I quickly packed up, but as I was walking toward the kite two young boys came out of nowhere headed straight for it. I had to quicken my pace to intercept! lol

to avoid tears and wears on your kite right now in the beginners level, do not rub or slide your kite on the sand if it is on it's back (nose away from flier) just put it in launch position and tug on the line un-even to you to make it square rather than trying to make it square to you when it is leaning on its back. This will keep your trailing edge from wearing too soon and protect the back of the kite/sail too.

For trailing edge, do not attempt to fly the kite when you crashed with leading edge on the ground. Unless you are on hard sand and know this recovery method. in the Prism DVD it shows you how to launch in this position, but he is doing it on hard sand and not the corals and crushed shells you have there.
I used Insigna tape myself (bought from Steve here) and it works really well.


Ah, I never thought of this. Thank you. I will keep that in mind next time. I had my wife with me yesterday, so she set me back up half the time while the other half I just made took the walk myself. I only dragged the kite around a few times to attempt the "cartwheel" retrieval, but I wasn't able to do it.

Quote
Then an important rule for beginners is to give maximum slack to the kite when diving towards the ground. If you need to run, jump forward like a goal keeper, DO IT! Lol this will save you additional expenses in repairs and avoid frustrations :)


Haha! I definitely will remember this! Most of the time it just happened so fast I wasn't able to react. I'll be on my toes from now on.  :D
 
Quote
As for the bag, get you the sleeve for now and when you reach +3 kites, then you can look into a kite bag..for now save your bucks for another kite....you will soon want another one ;)


I already have 2 more coming soon!  ;D
[/quote]


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: DWayne on April 29, 2012, 02:23 PM
Way cool  ;)
My first dual line was a Hypnotist.
Great kite to learn on.

Denny


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: st3307 on April 29, 2012, 04:53 PM
  with  my  Kites  the  kite  goes in  the   sleeve  then   the  sleeve    goes  in   the   bag    and    my  advice  is  always  store  the kite  in a  sleeve  even   while  in the    bag   keeps   all the     bridles and   part  for  that   kite   from  either being    tried  up  in  a  knot  on the    bridle   or  trying  to  figer  out   what    rod   goes   with   what  kite.     Welcome to the  forum  and  welcome  to  the  fun    and      smiles  of  kite   flying   


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: Ca Ike on April 29, 2012, 05:25 PM
If Steve still has some available, this is one of the best bags for the price.   http://www.chicokites.com/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=45 (http://www.chicokites.com/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=45)

Only draw back is you can only hold 5 kites if you put a lot of stuff in the pocket.  !0 if you add a pocket on the outside like I did.


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: madhabitz on April 30, 2012, 12:21 AM
Ah, okay. Let me ask this, though. Do most of you guys with kite bags have the kites inside the bag also individually sleeved? In other words, would buying sleeves become redundant when you finally do get a bag?
Kite into sleeve, sleeved kite into bag.... for all of the reasons Bobby (st3307) mentioned. Plus there will be times when you just want to grab a kite for a fast trip to the park.


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 30, 2012, 10:22 AM
Sounds good. Thanks, guys.

I'll pick up a few sleeves now and then see about a bag in the near future. I think the Hypno will be sufficient as a 2-line stunt flyer for a while. There are others I'd like to get, of course, but I don't really see a need to beat up multiple, and more expensive, kites at this stage. Right now I'm just looking to add single lines to my collection so the rest of the family can get in the air as well.

Thanks again, everyone

edit: Quick question, I attempted to go out again yesterday, but wasn't able to get off the ground. I'm thinking that having a low wind kite would be a good idea. I've seen plenty of reviews on my available options, so I won't re-ask the same old questions, but what I wanted to know is would getting a 4D be detrimental for me while learning? In other words would the smaller size this early in the game make it awkward when going back and forth between the Hypno or should I just get something full sized? The only thing that bothers me about the latter isn't the extra money so much, just that I don't really want to put a $200+ kite through the rigors of a beginner.


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: WinterDaze on April 30, 2012, 04:48 PM
KSC, if you can (on purpose ;)) keep the Hypno off the ground in good wind then you are going to be fine with a 4D, the 4D flown in light wind will teach you much about foot work, a most undervalued aspect of good freestyle flying.

Pick a colour and press the button  8)

WD


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 30, 2012, 05:21 PM
Yeah, that makes a lot sense. It seemed like the logical choice to me as well, I just wanted to be sure there wasn't anything full-sized in the same price range thereabouts before pulling the trigger. I've seen some comments on here about the 4D being a fun kite for those that already knew what they were doing or for younger flyers just starting out, I just wasn't sure if the smaller size was going to hinder me somehow, ya know?


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: WinterDaze on April 30, 2012, 06:36 PM
They are all different, some more so than others, these 2 will be quite different beasts, not a bad thing but now you know, the 4D uses inputs close to that of writing a letter, where the Hypno inputs are similar to bagging nails into wood...

I wouldn't say 'hinder' per se, more along the lines of 'offering a more considered journey'...


HTH

WD


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on April 30, 2012, 07:08 PM
Ah, great analogy. I will keep that in mind.

For now, I'm thinking maybe I'm getting a bit overzealous. I'm going to get out there with the Hypno for a few weeks and get some more flying time under my belt before I go ahead and invest too heavily into the hobby. So far, I'm really loving it, but I should make sure it really sticks before getting too crazy, you know? I have a tendency to do that on occasion.

Thank you for the advice.


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: ko on April 30, 2012, 08:42 PM
at this stage of the game I say stick with the hypno. reason being is you need to learn the lighter inputs it takes to keep a kite in the air in lower winds. the 4d is a fun kite but you dont want to use it as a crutch to make things easier and not learn the finer aspects of a kite with limited load on the sail. this is JMO . but and as always HAVE FUN KO PS there are alot of sul's out there better than the 4D
sorry Mark


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on May 01, 2012, 04:59 PM
That's what I initially figured. It just seemed to me like "no wind" flying is something you learn when you already know what you're doing already. Not that you can't learn on a 4D, I'm just thinking at this stage in the game, being that winds near my house are so inconsistent, it's totally possible I'd end up logging more hours on the 4D than the Hypno. Like you said, that could be a bit crutchy.

I don't even know what I want, but I do feel like a UL would be nice to have. The shore, where the winds are great, is over 90mins away. I can only go there on weekends and I'm really itching to fly more. I was thinking about a Zephyr, but that's not really a UL, either. Besides, I really shouldn't be abusing $200+ kites. Oh well, no need to rush it. I'll get there eventually.


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on May 04, 2012, 06:58 PM
So, how long does it take exactly before you can tell, just by looking out the window, that it's not worth attempting to fly? That damned wind has been playing me for the fool all week! I see it moving in the trees, waving flags, and I feel it on my face, yet when I trek out to the field, set up my kite, and unwind my lines, I'm left standing there like a boob tugging on an anchor with two chains. Frustrating.


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: RobB on May 04, 2012, 09:23 PM
So, how long does it take exactly before you can tell, just by looking out the window, that it's not worth attempting to fly? That damned wind has been playing me for the fool all week! I see it moving in the trees, waving flags, and I feel it on my face, yet when I trek out to the field, set up my kite, and unwind my lines, I'm left standing there like a boob tugging on an anchor with two chains. Frustrating.

 :D  :D  :D

Yup. It took me about a week of flying to realize I needed a light wind kite. I think my first light wind kite was an HQ Floater. Not a great name, maybe something lost in the translation... I had the luck of finding a NikNak soon after, and I was hooked on light wind flying. You should get a 4D because it's cheap, and will fly in ZERO wind up to 7+mph. Even though the 4D is small, it will help your flying. The inputs you learn flying the 4D smoothly will help you to easily fly any kite smoothly.



Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: B-13 on May 05, 2012, 06:11 AM
Being on an island with almost all year round wind (assuming you are on the right side of the island lol)

I used to fly after the office hours when i started out and all day long i will watch the trees outside through my window :)
Now i fly on a large beach only during the weekends and i can say it's worth waiting for that day against frustrations.
You can watch some tutorials, read some old posts and learn a lot during the week days and put all this into practice on weekends :)
I know how it is and i knew this before...i even knew this again this year when i started quad lines kites...

I was once tempted with the 4D too but now that i have my flying habits and scheduled days, i realised that the 4D would have sit in the bag for eternity...

B


Title: Re: Hypnotized!
Post by: KSC on May 05, 2012, 06:33 AM
You both make valid points. On one hand the 4D seems like a good cheap(er) option to have on-hand just to have something when the urge strikes, but the wind doesn't. On the flip side, I have been watching and reading almost non-stop since I started. I swear I've played that Freestyle Pilot DVD more times than Star Wars (ok, not really), but that's actually making it worse. Every time I see something cool on there, I'm dying to try it. The other day I was walking into Toys R Us practicing the hand motions for a snap stall. I probably looked like a total goon!   

Now it is the weekend, and I can travel the hour to go to the shore, but I have birthday party today, it could rain tomorrow, my anniversary and Mother's Day are next weekend...I'm telling ya, the first morning the wind pulls the door shut as I step outside on my way to work, I'm calling in sick.  >:(