GWTW Forum

Kites! Kites! Kites! => Kite Building and Repair => Topic started by: Lou on March 30, 2013, 08:06 PM



Title: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on March 30, 2013, 08:06 PM
Well... to wash the taste of frustration from the Spectra Reactor restoration projects I have decided to try my hand at kite building.  I started reading the Le Quartz build project online and said to myself... "I might be able to pull this one off!"  :D

Here are some photos of the right side sail after spending 8 hours today doing the following:

1. Rushing to store to purchase ripstop nylon (sadly not Icarex or Chikara), fabric glue and red poly on poly thread.
2. Printing the templates and blueprint pages then taping them all together!!!  Next time single sheet complete prints at Staples!! 
3. I will next time hot cut on glass or other hard smooth surface, hardboard left too much debris on the sail edges. 
4. Paper templates are terrible to hot knife along.  Next serious project kite I will make proper templates from some hard material via water-jet.
5. Setting up the old Kenmore 1345 was simple enough... but only after spending 20 minutes trying to download a .pdf of the instruction manual!!!!  By the way... I need ALOT of practice at sewing and need to study up on sewing principles.  Setting tensions was so time consuming trying to find that sweet spot for the stitch of choice.

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-03-30_22-19-45_846.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-03-30_22-19-13_640.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-03-30_23-35-47_537.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-03-30_23-35-58_873.jpg)





Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: PUZZLE on March 30, 2013, 08:18 PM
looks nice


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: thief on March 31, 2013, 05:23 AM
Templates can easily be made from a cardstock like material with great results.......cover the edge with aluminum Duct tape (the real stuff not the duck tape) to help the template last longer....

While that material you got will teach you a lot it is going to act differently than what you will find in the sport kites on the market either icarex or nylon.... even while sewing it will stretch a lot more....and flight...well....I would suggest not framing this because that material will fit funky.....

But like you said you are learning a lot!!!!!
Tension is one of the top things to learn about your machine.....keep your needles sharp - if you hear a popping sound with each needle down stroke you need a new needle......


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on March 31, 2013, 05:48 AM
Yes I knew this material was insufficient for performance but it allowed me to see whether or not I was even capable of hot cutting and sewing decently.  These two processes I felt were the hardest and I feel totally competent now to continue with kite building.

I am going to continue refining the hot cut process with your advice on the templates, that was an awesome idea.  I did purchase packages of #80 and #100 needles as I had no clue what needle was on the machine before.

I am actually going to frame this sail in pultruded or glass and mount in the house.  This is in fact still my very first kite build.  You know Lamborghini did make farm tractors before he started making supercars!  ;D


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: thief on March 31, 2013, 05:13 PM
Sounds good!!!
Is the le quartz supposed to be in icarex or nylon?


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on March 31, 2013, 06:52 PM
Sounds good!!!
Is the le quartz supposed to be in icarex or nylon?

The project lists Icarex to be used.  I also found that, as you stated, with the way ripstop nylon has a stretch to it I had problems gluing and sewing the spine because of the concave shape it creates when put together.  It was terrible to get each end to meet perfectly, because of the stretching I caused when pulling the materials in, to be lined up then glued.  I still learned a lot about the process of attaching the two halves though.  This will definitely save me the pain in my wallet by learning about these issues and developing the techniques before hand and wasting expensive materials.

By the way.... where has all the 31g per mē Icarex Ripstop Polyester gone?!?!?!  I'm definitely not paying overseas shipping on a couple sq. yards of poly.  Any retailers in the states??


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ca Ike on March 31, 2013, 10:59 PM
Only place to get Icarex is Jon T since Bonnie is closed for good now.  YOu can go to kite builder or goodwinds and get Silicon coated 3/4 oz nylon for ~7 a yard and thats good for  most any kite project.  Right now Icarex is running ~$15 a yard.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ara Ararauna on April 01, 2013, 01:40 AM
Well done.
It is indeed very good practice.
I decided to go the hard way from the beginning with the real thing and I suffered quite a bit in some parts where I thought I had almost wrecked the whole thing... *sigh* ... too much stress for my nerves and health   :-[

Here you can see the process I followed in case it helps you:
http://www.gwtwforum.com/index.php?topic=9002.0 (http://www.gwtwforum.com/index.php?topic=9002.0)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: thief on April 01, 2013, 04:40 AM
kitebuilder also has ZMax which is another polycarbonate material like icarex....i have heard good things about it....

sil-nylon (silicone coated nylon) is not something i would suggest for a first sewing project...that is slick stuff.......reguires a steady hand...good set up...and def double sided tape...


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 01, 2013, 07:59 AM
kitebuilder also has ZMax which is another polycarbonate material like icarex....i have heard good things about it....

sil-nylon (silicone coated nylon) is not something i would suggest for a first sewing project...that is slick stuff.......reguires a steady hand...good set up...and def double sided tape...

Right now I'm using Fabric Fusion to attach the sail parts.. been somewhat of a pain actually and somewhat messy if the parts tear apart and spread glue all over.  What tapes are there that would best be used?

When you mention ZMax did you mean PMax or PolyMax?


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ara Ararauna on April 01, 2013, 08:27 AM
kitebuilder also has ZMax which is another polycarbonate material like icarex....i have heard good things about it....

sil-nylon (silicone coated nylon) is not something i would suggest for a first sewing project...that is slick stuff.......reguires a steady hand...good set up...and def double sided tape...

Right now I'm using Fabric Fusion to attach the sail parts.. been somewhat of a pain actually and somewhat messy if the parts tear apart and spread glue all over.  What tapes are there that would best be used?

I used 5mm double-sided tape which is very easy and clean to use. I think it is sold at many stationery stores, but I actually bought a large roll at my local kite shop.
Cheers


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: thief on April 01, 2013, 08:27 AM
i use the 1/4" double sided tape that KB sells....


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 01, 2013, 08:35 AM
i use the 1/4" double sided tape that KB sells....


Well ... that should help with seam attaching and NO MESS application!!  :D 

I also tried to find that aluminum tape to edge the card stock templates for hot cutting but had no luck.  Any retailers that come to mind where this has been purchased?


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: DD on April 01, 2013, 08:41 AM
home depot has cold weather foil tape. I also got my hands on some thicker tape that they use to patch planes. Not sure where it came from


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: thief on April 01, 2013, 08:47 AM
i get my aluminum duct tape at ACE hardware (its the place you know)....
but pretty much every hardware store should have thiss in their heating supply section.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 01, 2013, 08:52 AM
i get my aluminum duct tape at ACE hardware (its the place you know)....
but pretty much every hardware store should have thiss in their heating supply section.


Thanks to the both of you.  I'll hit Ace tonight after work and see what I can find.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ca Ike on April 01, 2013, 01:36 PM
i use the 1/4" double sided tape that KB sells....


Well ... that should help with seam attaching and NO MESS application!!  :D 

I also tried to find that aluminum tape to edge the card stock templates for hot cutting but had no luck.  Any retailers that come to mind where this has been purchased?
Any hardware store should have it.  Its the same aluminum tape used for ductwork.  A couple more tips when working with clothing nylon for kites.  First you can use spray on urethane clear coat to coat and stabilize the fabric. Coat before you assemble the panels so you minimize fray and stretch while assembling.  Second pay real close attention to the bias and make sure you line it up right.  Depending on the kite pattern you may have to make more panels in order to do it.  IF your going to use seam tape make sure you have some sewers aid to lube the needle and thread to help prevent glue build up.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 02, 2013, 04:23 PM
Can anyone please advise the best method to attach the two halves.  Is it best to start at the top or bottom, or maybe even the center T area and work outwards.  Not sure why i continue to have issues with not lining up ends.  I think this ripstop is just distorted somehow.  Is the ripstop from Goodwinds that hard to work with?  They appear to have the most available right now or should I really just wait for rip poly of some type?

Another question.  Looking to buy a new sewing machine and most don't use the feet pressure like this old Kenmore.  Is the foot pressure option super important for thin slick materials.  I seem to have left my foot pressure in the same spot.  I'm thinking though it might be best to buy a new machine with the same features like the old one as I think my sewing actually looked pretty good.  It just seems I will be spending $200 plus for features I may not need for kite building at least.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ca Ike on April 02, 2013, 06:31 PM
IF your machine works don't replace it yet until you decide how into this your going to get.  One thing you can do to help a bit is take a hair dryer on  high and use it to shrink the material back some.  THen line up the halves from nose to center T first then center T to tail.  THe bottom has a broad seam (curve) line that can be a pain to get right so take your time with it.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: thief on April 03, 2013, 10:22 AM
You could pony up a butt load of cash and get a new machine that has a walking for and that would help... but it is not necessary...I use a 50+ year old singer without any issues......I did get an after market walking for but do not even use it anymore......

That material will most likely have slipped as little during sewing and might not line up..........it creeps............

Ripstop that is used in kites ( whether nylon or poly) will not experience this issue..


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 03, 2013, 03:46 PM
I had the day off today so I did some more on the kite to pass the afternoon.  Sorry the images are poor quality today.  Storm is rolling through and quite dark out right now.  I didn't have ripstop in a 1 in. wide roll so I used what I had left from the sq. yard and made strips.  So now I have a two tone trailing edge  ???

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-03_18-34-50_701.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-03_18-34-38_927.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-03_18-35-05_468.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-03_18-35-19_748.jpg)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ca Ike on April 03, 2013, 08:52 PM
I only see one real mistake so far. You should be using a 3-step zig-zag stitch also called an elastic stitch for your panel seams.  Other than that it looks good


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 04, 2013, 05:56 AM
I am using a 3-step zig zag... I think the first images, at the start of the thread show it.  I did however make the 3-step zig zag a bit smaller for now to make sure I stay within the seam.  I will increase the width and length as I get more proficient.   ;D

I also want to change the frame specs.  It calls for the following framework:

6mm pultruded for the LEs, Spine and Upper Spreader. 
5PT for the Lower Spreader. 


I want to go full P-Series, PT-Series or PX-Series.  Any suggestions of which to use throughout the frame.  I was going to do the following:

5PT -or- 2PX LEs and Lower Spreader. 
P300 -or- 3PX Spine.
1PX/2PX -or- P100/P200 Upper Spreader.[/
i] 

Not sure how that would balance out as the pultruded that is spec'd out is so darn heavy and flexing.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: coogee on April 04, 2013, 10:10 AM
The "usual" skyshark frame I use for something like this is P200 LE and spine, 5PT LS and 6mm carbon US. Of course every one has there own idea of how to frame kites and there is always room for innovation, especially if you have a few bibs and bobs lying around. Using the mix of P200 and 5PT and 6mm is cheap, robust and easily replaced if you have a breakage. This is the frame in my Deep Space which I have beaten up mercilessly for years and still has the original rods. It also works a treat!
 Mike


Title: Re: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: cerfvoliste on April 04, 2013, 10:25 AM
Does not look like a 3 step zig-zag to me either. Just a 2 step. Give us a closer look.
CV

P.S. I was able to zoom in, does not look like a 3 step.

Remember, No Matter Where You Go, There You Are.


Title: Re: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: madhabitz on April 04, 2013, 11:00 AM
For curved edges, using binding cut on the bias is a big help. Here is a link to a tutorial:
http://www.sew4home.com/tips-resources/sewing-tips-tricks/how-make-continuous-bias-binding

Once you get into it, you will see just how easy it is to do. This method also saves fabric.


Title: Re: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 04, 2013, 11:18 AM
Does not look like a 3 step zig-zag to me either. Just a 2 step. Give us a closer look.
CV

P.S. I was able to zoom in, does not look like a 3 step.

Remember, No Matter Where You Go, There You Are.


Well darn.... What exactly does the 3-step look like.  Is there a couple more needle pokes in between each leg of the zig zag.  I'm trying to look up images right now to understand what I did. 

Here is a pic of two stitch types from my current machine. The one above is what I think is a correct 3-step zig zag.  The one below is the stitch I was using.
 
(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/c0d58617-1fcd-4d52-8974-ae4f4d649512.jpg)

Thanks for pointing it out, that saved me a bunch a money had I done this on expensive Icarex!!  Will this stitch at least hold during flight or is this build to be scrapped.  If so then I guess it is back to the fabric store for some new ripstop nylon to try this again.  :P  You know even with this mistake I am sill excited about having learned some more about kite building.  This definitely is a great subset to this hobby, especially when Florida doesn't want to bring enough wind inland!!!!


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ca Ike on April 04, 2013, 01:21 PM
It will be fine just not as forgiving.  THe 3-step can move more with the fabric as it stretches which is why they use it for elastic. I'd be more concerned with that nylon giving up before the stitching.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: cerfvoliste on April 04, 2013, 08:16 PM
What Ike said. It should be fine (nice looking kite by the way). The 3-Point (like your example on top) is the preffered kite makers stitch. Try it next time.
CV


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 04, 2013, 09:35 PM
What Ike said. It should be fine (nice looking kite by the way). The 3-Point (like your example on top) is the preffered kite makers stitch. Try it next time.
CV

I was reviewing a lot of other build guides and saw that the 2-Step Zigzag I used is used often on the TE and the Spine reinforcements.  So I wasn't going too crazy when I thought to use that stitch :D  I think I will break the stiches on the sail seams and practice the 3-Step Zigzag.  Then it will only be about 5% sewn incorrectly rather than 95%  :( 

Wish me luck!


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: thief on April 05, 2013, 05:22 AM
i want to point out that a 2step zigzag is just fine....the 3 step does add extra thread strength in the seams but i know some kite makers that use the 2 step all the time.....
and especially as you are learning about your machine!   Some machines do stitches better than others.....some kite makers only use straight stitches....some use computerized machines that sew patterns and letters.....

you will also find the 2 step being used in situations where there is a reverse (or standard) applique on the skin...
and you will also find it used when the seam is a simple Flat Felled Seam where you put two pieces face to face and then sew  a seam down an edge using a straight stitch, then open the faces up and you sew the doubled up pieces down onside or the other of the first seam....for this i use a 2 step....
(http://www.sewing.org/assets/images/FLAT_FELT_SEAM.gif)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 05, 2013, 07:08 AM
Yes, the Reactors are sewn exactly as you show in the images above.  I guess I'll leave this first sail alone and just grab some fabric and try another color scheme using the 3-Step Zigzag.  I am defintely not using the nylon I bought before.  It's .75 oz and non-coated.  Outside of wind resistance, does the coating actually help keep the fabric stiff and stretch less?

What strength of line would you use for a leech line?  Is 200# dacron line overkill?

Also, what stand off connectors should I use on the Le Quartz when installing 5PT lower spreaders.  The site states the following:

Stand ]off Junction 6x5,3 mm 6 pcs leading edges, lower spreader??

What APA is that... I know the stand off rod is 3mm, the spreader for a tapered 5PT rod is 6mm?, 5mm?, 5.3mm?


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: WolvenX on April 08, 2013, 01:58 AM
Question!  What is the best glue to use on the sails before stitching ?   


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 08, 2013, 06:02 AM
I have had excellent results with Fabric Fusion.  Only downside is that it takes approx. 2 hours to truly handle the material.  The glue dries flexible and clean.  It does not gum up your needle.  You can still pull apart the panels if needed with some minor force if you make a mistake with setup.  ;)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 08, 2013, 07:58 AM
I need to order the spars for the Le Quartz.  What is the best 100% Sky Shark frame setup for a STD and for a LW build.  I've gone in circles a few times and really need expert advice from those who have built and flown these kites.  I keep coming up with different setups and not sure how balance will be since I won't be using the 6mm high modulus tubes.

I guess a good STD setup is as follows:

P100 US
P200 ULEs
P300 LLEs, Spine
5PT LS

I was hoping to make a simple, easy setup using this:

P2X complete frame w/ P3X Spine.  I love the look of the PX tubes and wonder how different they are to the P-Series and the PT-Series


Here is an update image of the completed sail.  Sorry for terrible lighting again and picture quality.

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-06_23-29-52_499.jpg)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: WolvenX on April 08, 2013, 02:18 PM
Thx for the info!   And the sail looks really cool well done  :)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 10, 2013, 06:57 AM
Well I tore apart the nose cap again to try sugarbaker's method and I think I agree with his statement of making the nose a bit more flexible with less Dacron in that area.  I didn't think the full Dacron strip down the center was as effective in concept.  The upper spreader wear on the sail would eventually require a patch diamond sewn on anyway in the future.  So now I've somehow found myself attempting to develop a more refined nose cap in Dacron that will incorporate increased flexibility.  Kite building is an incredible expression of form following function and sometimes function following form.  ;)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 10, 2013, 02:48 PM
Well here is the latest installment of Le Quartz and Kite Building 101 Crash Course for me.  I still am not sure what Sky Shark frame setup I should use for a STD or UL.  I temporarily used 1/4 in. wood rods to test fit the sail and of course there is almost NO sail tension as the wood is ULTRA WEAK.  :(  It did let me get some pictures out to you all.  I did make the carbon stand-offs though.  Any input on frame selection would be appreciated.

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-10_17-33-47_270.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-10_17-34-10_179.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-10_17-34-25_851.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-10_17-34-49_525.jpg)



(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-10_17-35-12_109.jpg)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: coogee on April 10, 2013, 07:59 PM
The "usual" skyshark frame I use for something like this is P200 LE and spine, 5PT LS and 6mm carbon US. Of course every one has there own idea of how to frame kites and there is always room for innovation, especially if you have a few bibs and bobs lying around. Using the mix of P200 and 5PT and 6mm is cheap, robust and easily replaced if you have a breakage. This is the frame in my Deep Space which I have beaten up mercilessly for years and still has the original rods. It also works a treat!
 Mike


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 10, 2013, 08:55 PM
Thanks sorry I had missed that earlier in the post.  That frame set you mentioned again follows the 15oz stick concept with some flex on the spine and LEs and rigidity on the spreaders. Since I have a lot of APA D connectors and 7mm stoppers I'll go with that setup but exchange the 6mm carbon US and 5PT LS and replace with 2PX.  Tube weight will be the same and we will see how close the 2PX and the 5PT are in stiffness.

I also just noticed the R-Sky Frenezy is literally spot on to the Le Quartz.  This is their frame specs that I'm sure they use for cost and durability which is a good base to start with:

Upper leading edge  - 6 mm
Lower leading edge  - 6 mm
Lower spreaders      - P200
Spine                     - 6 mm
Top Cross               - 6 mm


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 12, 2013, 10:22 AM
Ok, so I decided on the following based on cost and the great prices Jon and Marieanne had over at Kites and Fun Things.  These were ordered from their surplus and B class tubes list.

Upper leading edge  - P2X
Lower leading edge  - P2X
Lower spreaders      - Nitro STD unsanded (purchased APA Db to fit to LE)
Spine                     - P2X 
Upper Spreader       - P2X (May use G-Force UL stick I have laying around) 

The P2X are 2/3 Camo but for $3.00 I couldnt say no for a test kite airframe, especially if covered by the LE pockets and sail material.  I wonder if there is anyway to sand the camo/finish off and clear over, or even leave sanded?

I think this should be a fairly solid airframe configuration to practice freestyle tricks on.  I've always flown precision so this will start a new chapter, we'll see how well the airframe holds up with my kids trying to fly this also!! ???


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ca Ike on April 12, 2013, 10:32 AM
Being in pockets and on the back side I wouldn't worry about the camo.  With that frame you will already be  bottom heavy so you might need to take out some tail weight.  PRobably around 3-5g but play around and see.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 12, 2013, 11:00 AM
Being in pockets and on the back side I wouldn't worry about the camo.  With that frame you will already be  bottom heavy so you might need to take out some tail weight.  PRobably around 3-5g but play around and see.

The P2x camo are actually 16g sticks as they are "mega wrapped".  The unsanded Nitro STD sticks are actually listed 15-16g.  I will play with the weights but you think it will be that "bottom heavy"?


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ca Ike on April 12, 2013, 02:41 PM
Yes it will simply because there is more carbon in the bottom half of the kite than the top half.  Stick weight only plays into the whole weight of the kite. Its how you distribute that weight that affects the kite.  YOu will be close to balance with that frame but you nay not need as much tail weight as the plans call for considering the suggested frame.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 12, 2013, 06:39 PM
Sounds good, thanks for the input.  I'll be working on the bridle over the weekend and hopefully the tubes will be in early next week.  I'll also let you when I'll grab the Nuke late next week.  Thanks again Ca Ike.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: mikenchico on April 12, 2013, 11:52 PM
You could sand that camo off, but I did give a quick attempt once and it would've been far too much work for what? Jon sold the original Freestylists with Camo rods to keep costs down, and the kite is still one of my favorites. I've used them for replacements and reframed a TOTL Hawaiian in camo P400's, they've never bothered me. If it really bothers you take a Sharpie to them where the camo might show through the spreader cut outs.

BWT, your first attempt looks nice, especially considering using a fabric store ripstop. I tried some of that stuff once on an experiment and found it nearly impossible to work with, at least compared to true sail fabric. Be looking forward to seeing what you do with a more stable fabric.



Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 13, 2013, 11:59 AM
BWT, your first attempt looks nice, especially considering using a fabric store ripstop. I tried some of that stuff once on an experiment and found it nearly impossible to work with, at least compared to true sail fabric. Be looking forward to seeing what you do with a more stable fabric.

Thanks for the compliment.  I learned an incredible amount of information on kite building.  The fabric store ripstop was hard to work with initially, then again it was my first time sewing anyway.  I learned to understand my machine and what it took to sew this material type.  If proper sail fabric is easier to work with then I can't wait.  I still want to purchase a Singer Heavy Duty which I feel with its feature set I could do much better work with less effort.  I still want to try a few other products for sail fabrication so I may do one more sail in this material for cost.  Once all my assembly materials are established I will try the proper sail ripstop nylons.  Then after that move to Icarex when I know what kite type and colors I like best!


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 17, 2013, 03:15 PM
Well, my Nocks, P2X camo and B-Stock Nitro STD (unsanded) rods came in today.  I completed the frame and changed the leech line to the bungie tension system.  Yes, I didn't use the best materials first time out, in fact there is zero Dacron and Mylar in this particular sail because I never expected to actually successfully complete this, so I saved those materials for the next sail build, but I am still pretty proud of it.  I made mistakes and learned from them.  I incorporated different techniques of assembly not listed on Tom's site and made a better, more adjustable kite than expected.  I have all the part numbers and specifications cataloged.  I also now have the processes understood where before I was confused or was just totally lost based on some of the minor holes in the instructional.  I would like to thank everyone who helped me with my questions and to guys like Tom and sugarbaker who post their step-by-step build efforts.  Without those instructionals I would have asked a ton more questions!!  Total cost of this build in materials was approximately $65.00   :D

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-17_17-50-12_408.jpg) (http://s144.photobucket.com/user/photobucket2007_bucket/media/2013-04-17_17-50-12_408.jpg.html)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-17_17-50-24_813.jpg) (http://s144.photobucket.com/user/photobucket2007_bucket/media/2013-04-17_17-50-24_813.jpg.html)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-17_17-50-30_61.jpg) (http://s144.photobucket.com/user/photobucket2007_bucket/media/2013-04-17_17-50-30_61.jpg.html)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-17_17-50-41_475.jpg) (http://s144.photobucket.com/user/photobucket2007_bucket/media/2013-04-17_17-50-41_475.jpg.html)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-17_17-50-45_622.jpg) (http://s144.photobucket.com/user/photobucket2007_bucket/media/2013-04-17_17-50-45_622.jpg.html)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-17_17-50-49_832.jpg) (http://s144.photobucket.com/user/photobucket2007_bucket/media/2013-04-17_17-50-49_832.jpg.html)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-17_17-50-58_654.jpg) (http://s144.photobucket.com/user/photobucket2007_bucket/media/2013-04-17_17-50-58_654.jpg.html)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-17_17-51-03_632.jpg) (http://s144.photobucket.com/user/photobucket2007_bucket/media/2013-04-17_17-51-03_632.jpg.html)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-17_17-51-27_41.jpg) (http://s144.photobucket.com/user/photobucket2007_bucket/media/2013-04-17_17-51-27_41.jpg.html)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: thief on April 17, 2013, 05:15 PM
Looks great! Going to fly it soon ?


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 17, 2013, 06:56 PM
I'm sadly not in possession of any suitable line at the moment.  I have the 150# 100ft set from the Nukes for HW which is anchor line for this smaller kite.  I did make a 25# 50ft set from Walmart Dyneema line for $2.25, until I purchase the right set.  If the 25# doesn't seem too weak on short lines I should be able to launch her Saturday.

What is typical for this size/type kite?  I would think around a 90/90?  I think a local shop here in Titusville, FL has some Shanti Speed Line 85ft/90# sleeved with winder for $36.  I'm trying to keep this a budget build but may need to spend some cash on appropriate line.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: thief on April 18, 2013, 04:41 AM
90# line would work.....personally i have 150# lines on all of my sport kites....including the just over 6' Aziza.....

Walmart has dyneema? from what department? fishing???????hmm.....weird....

i know where there are some good priced linesets....


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ara Ararauna on April 18, 2013, 05:41 AM
Well done Spectra!
It is really nice to see how you undertook the project with caution to see where you could get to and that in the end everything came out so well.
This makes us all be looking forward to seeing it fly as well as seeing what will be the formal/final sail with the best material.
Cheers!


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 18, 2013, 06:03 AM
90# line would work.....personally i have 150# lines on all of my sport kites....including the just over 6' Aziza.....

Walmart has dyneema? from what department? fishing???????hmm.....weird....

i know where there are some good priced linesets....

There is a small kite section in our local Walmart at this time of year.  I purchased an extra small roll of line for my daughters $10 foil kite and the material description is actually nylon LOL!!  Not sure why I thought it read dyneema.  Apparently thats some good stuff.

If you are using 150# without much issue I'll just use that then.  I think I may be going home early this morning so I may try to head over to Cocoa Beach and get a launch today!


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 18, 2013, 06:09 AM
Well done Spectra!
It is really nice to see how you undertook the project with caution to see where you could get to and that in the end everything came out so well.
This makes us all be looking forward to seeing it fly as well as seeing what will be the formal/final sail with the best material.
Cheers!


I appreciate the kind words and at this time feel compelled to leave this particular Le Quartz as it is.  I started the project on my daughter's 8th birthday and she helped me glue the panels in place that afternoon.  Maybe, I may return to it to create a performance sail.  Maybe I will just build an entire Le Quartz.  I sort of have an attachment to its crudeness in materials.  A sort of McGyver of kites for me.  8)

I intend to start my next kite build with proper materials in a larger size like the Invictus/Sixth Sense/Vortex/Iridium projects.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 18, 2013, 06:32 AM
Here is also a video of my son trying the kite out for the first time.  I still have not completed a weight system for this kite so the tail tends to fly loose and doesnt sit downward at all.  Looks like I need to start making another kite as he really seems to like kite flying.  He also attempted some tricks he thought he understood from a Prism Tutorial Video although not successful in any of them I give him an A+ for effort!

 (http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-18_18-52-54_623.mp4)


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Ara Ararauna on April 19, 2013, 12:00 PM
Great!
Looks really pretty in the sky and flies quite well for being all the low cost materials!
And yes, you must foster your child to continue flying. He's already doing nice turtles!
Cheers.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 24, 2013, 11:47 AM
Been pretty busy at work so haven't updated much this week.  Took the family and kite out to the Space Coast over the weekend and flew it for a couple hours in 15+ / 20+ gust winds.  Held up quite nicely although still needed a weight system in the tail and didn't get around to crafting that portion until today.  I went to Lowe's and found bronze spacers weighing 6.5 grams each and o-rings that worked out quite well.  I will need to either machine these spacers in half for a more finite ballast control or go online and order them in the shorter sizes.  13 grams seems to be ok for my slightly heavier bottom end kite.  I again am not sure how the majority of people run the leech line but I passed the line across and through the APA connector hole for each line.  I didn't like the line drag on the rubber through the hole and I really didn't like NOT running the leech line through the APA connector at all, so I cut a short piece of P2X tube and insert it into the APA connector making sure to round out the edges smoothly.  The leech line passes through very nicely and the APA hole has rigidity and support now.  Looks to be working out very well.

I also purchased from Amazon.com a refurbished Singer Heavy Duty 4423 and Even Feed / Walking Foot for $60.00 + $16.97 + Free Shipping, which came in yesterday.  This machine sews like a dream and through just about anything, even wood and lead (youtube promo video.. no way I'm trying that!).  I later went to Staples and had the Invictus, Sixth Sense, Iridium and Vortex blueprints printed on A0 and got those laid out on the work bench.  I need to decide which one to build first.  Once the materials arrive I will start a legitimate kite build.   ;D

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-24_13-13-34_793.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-24_13-13-02_834.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-24_13-13-52_156.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-24_16-42-43_568.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-24_16-42-12_628.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-24_16-42-59_867.jpg)

(http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r167/photobucket2007_bucket/2013-04-24_16-43-06_53.jpg)



Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Kareloh on April 25, 2013, 02:52 AM
Nice work!

Don't forget to send a picture of your build to the creators of the website. They will add it to the builds page.


Title: Re: Le Quartz Project - First time behind the sewing machine!
Post by: Lou on April 26, 2013, 11:14 AM
i know where there are some good priced linesets....

Thief,

PM Sent... along with email!   :'(