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Author Topic: Problems with Premier sailboat delta  (Read 2045 times)
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SkyDancer
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« on: July 29, 2013, 06:07 AM »

Anyone have any experience with this 6.5-foot Premier sailboat delta?



It's advertised as very stable but we found it to be the opposite last night. It kept flying back and forth in larger and larger arcs until it finally nose-dove into the ground.

I suspect that the kite needed some extra drag to slow it down but we only had 10-12 mph wind. I didn't try putting more tail on it because a.) I think its supposed to fly without additional tail and b.) a long tail would disrupt the look of the kite. Adjusting the angle of attack wasn't an option because the flying line attaches to a single-point grommet in the keel.

At the same time on the same field, a Gomberg 7-foot delta flew flawlessly, pinned to the sky.

Has anyone else here flown the Premier sailboat and if so, what were your experiences?
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whitebirdlover
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« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2013, 04:35 PM »

Sounds like the tow point is too far back on the keel. Might be time to do a mod to add one or two forward of the factory position. Delta's should be relatively stable and that should have been a nice wind range.
You can use some dacron or even duct tape folded and fastened to both sides of the keel to find a good tow point and then make a permanent fitting.
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boomertype
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« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2013, 06:05 PM »

How much line did you have out?
Some SLKs do the pendulum thing till they have a bit of line out. Sometimes that's 50+ feet and a long line launch is the only answer.
Most times deltas are stable, but some are more stable than others.
Does yours have rods that go the whole length of the leading edges or just partial.
If they don't go the whole length, they must be positioned to the ends, not the nose.
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SkyDancer
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« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2013, 06:47 PM »

How much line did you have out?

Some SLKs do the pendulum thing till they have a bit of line out. Sometimes that's 50+ feet and a long line launch is the only answer.

We had close to 100 feet out by the time we gave up.

Quote
Does yours have rods that go the whole length of the leading edges or just partial.
If they don't go the whole length, they must be positioned to the ends, not the nose.

Leading edge rods are partial length and were along the bottoms of the leading edges.
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rtennant
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« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2013, 09:20 AM »

My wife just bought me a prism stowaway and I had the same problem with it. I hooked a small aluminum carabeener in the center tail loop on the bottom edge and it straightened right up.
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thief
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« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2013, 10:20 AM »

hmm....
instructions are here: http://www.premierkites.com/pdf/kites/33313.pdf
so...the way this kite is designed it could sort of become like a roller with the "hull" part of the sailboat acting as  the bottom sail on a roller....Rollers are phenomenal light wind flyers but in higer winds the use a keel on the bottom sail to help stablilize them.....

personally i would:
1)call premier to see if there is an issue...
2)scrap the keel that they have and put on a normal two leg bridle that you can adjust...there should be more than enough tail on this kite unless you are flying it above its wind range so that should not be an issue....
3) have some fun and put on a small shark windsock and play the Jaws theme while flying it....then it is the fact that the shark will stabilize it a bit more but also the boat will be trying to get away from it....(never said i was normal...)..

the only other thing i could imagine is that the kite ended up in a lever where there was a LOT more wind than there was on the ground with you....so....it was just being overpowered.......
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SkyDancer
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« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2013, 01:02 PM »



Thanks for the link. The instructions are not completely relevant, however, as they refer to a bridle, which my kite doesn't have. My kite instead has a keel.

Quote
personally i would:
1)call premier to see if there is an issue...


I don't relish the thought of waiting on hold and trying to get through to someone who really knows about kites. But then, I've never tried to call Premier so maybe it won't be that bad.

Quote
2)scrap the keel that they have and put on a normal two leg bridle that you can adjust...


Something I've considered although it discourages me that such modifications would be necessary on a brand new kite (we bought it this year at the Great Lakes Kite Festival in Grand Haven, Michigan).

Quote
there should be more than enough tail on this kite unless you are flying it above its wind range so that should not be an issue....


The wind was well within the range given in the instructions. The nearest airport was reporting 12 mph and while I took no field measurements, it didn't feel any stronger than that.

Quote
3) have some fun and put on a small shark windsock and play the Jaws theme while flying it....then it is the fact that the shark will stabilize it a bit more but also the boat will be trying to get away from it....(never said i was normal...)..


Cute idea in any case!

Quote
the only other thing i could imagine is that the kite ended up in a level where there was a LOT more wind than there was on the ground with you....so....it was just being overpowered.......


The kite was clearly overpowered but the question is why. The swing occurred even while the kite was close to the ground (12 mph), and I doubt the winds at 100 feet were that much stronger. The most likely explanation appears to be a tow point in the wrong place, which again disappoints the purchaser of a brand new Premier kite.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2013, 01:20 PM by SkyDancer » Logged

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thief
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« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2013, 01:13 PM »

it sounds like the first issue is that your kite has a keel instead of a bridle.....definitely call Premier about that......

if i understand correctly this kite is designed off an old skool 80's single line kite that flew great.......not certain who designed it but i remember seeing a few of them.....
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boomertype
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« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2013, 05:08 PM »

it sounds like the first issue is that your kite has a keel instead of a bridle.....definitely call Premier about that......

if i understand correctly this kite is designed off an old skool 80's single line kite that flew great.......not certain who designed it but i remember seeing a few of them.....

Several deltas have keels and no bridle.
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« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2013, 06:13 PM »

Oh I am aware of that as I have a few of them...I was just implying that there is obviously a discrepancy between what skydancer has and the instructions that premier provided.....
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SkyDancer
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« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2013, 06:03 PM »

Well, here's an update. I emailed Premier and got a reply promptly. They asked me to send a photo, which I did but it was inconclusive, so they asked me to send the kite to them.

I didn't have a box or tube long enough to ship the kite and ended up taking it to a retail shipping store. Packaging and shipping cost me $18. I sent it all back, including the 300 feet of 50-pound line on a handle that came with the kite. I was a little discouraged to spend $18 on top of the $60 I'd already paid for the kite.

After Premier received the kite, they wrote me to say that the only problem they noticed was that several struts were fitting abnormally tightly. They said they sometimes see shrinkage on some older model kite sails that causes this. I was surprised, because I didn't think shrinking was a problem with nylon.

Anyway, because couple of specs were off, they decided to completely re-strut the kite, using some spare 5mm carbon they had, making the kite much lighter. They even test-flew the kite before returning it.

Unfortunately, they forgot to return the flying line with the kite. After I pointed this out, they sent a second package, in which they included 500 feet of brand new flying line on a yo-yo winder, plus a large line-laundry jellyfish!

With the upgraded frame, new flying line and line laundry "consolation gift," I got more than I paid for, including the price of the original kite and the shipping expense.

By the way, the kite flies much better with the new frame. I haven't had a chance to fly the jellyfish yet, but if the sailboat delta will lift it, it'll look cute flying under the boat!

Bottom line: I'm very pleased with Premier and they've won a customer for life.
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rtennant
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« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2013, 09:38 AM »

I am glad you resolved the problem. I own a couple of Premier slk deltas. They have always performed flawlessly. I am glad to hear that if I need assisatance that Premier is there to help me out.
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