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Author Topic: Bent Rod / Spar  (Read 2232 times)
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Mikey1
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« on: June 04, 2014, 06:57 AM »

i put my 12 foot delta up a few days ago, i always double check the rods while assembling and everything was fine, the kite flew fine,

i brought the kite down and the landing was smooth as can be (no hitting the ground), when disassembling the kite i pulled the center spar out and it was noticeably bent!

it was bent to the point where i had great difficulty pulling the two rods apart, they normally slide apart with very little effort,

the winds were moderate and not heavy at all, i have flown it in much heavier winds before without any problems,

i am very disappointed with this, i treat my kites like they are my babies, this must have happened during the flight,

i have emailed the company where i bought the kite and they are conveniently ignoring my emails, its amazing how fast they reply when i was inquiring about purchasing the kite,

i have a picture of the rod but the site says its too big to upload
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thief
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« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2014, 10:25 AM »

lets see....
what is the spreader made from?
you will find much higher winds up further.....that might have wreaked havoc....
for the stuck ferrule:
there might be sand or something stuck in the ferrule....
the spreader might have splintered apart a little bit and is spread out inside the ferrule...

forward me the picture in an email and i can pop it up for you....

Did you contact the manufacturer company?
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Mikey1
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« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2014, 10:35 AM »

lets see....
what is the spreader made from?
you will find much higher winds up further.....that might have wreaked havoc....
for the stuck ferrule:
there might be sand or something stuck in the ferrule....
the spreader might have splintered apart a little bit and is spread out inside the ferrule...

forward me the picture in an email and i can pop it up for you....

Did you contact the manufacturer company?

all the rods are made from the same material including the spreader,

i believe it is carbon fiber, the spreader is fine, no problems there, the spreader is alot thicker than the other rods,

it is the center spine that bent that goes from nose to tail,

i have had the kite up over 800 feet in what i would consider high winds without issues,

on this particular day i had it up no more than 300 feet in light to moderate winds compared to the latter,

the carbon fiber rods themselves are all fine, no cracks, no splinters, it is the aluminum connector where the two rods connect that bent,

i always make sure the rods are fully inserted during assembly,

the rods on my 9 foot are half the diameter of these rods and i never had a problem there,

i will email you the pic, it will be easier to understand in a pic,
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thief
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« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2014, 10:46 AM »


nice ferrule!!!!

i would a)contact the manufacturer about it b)pick up a spare ferrule or two that is the correct size -also these might be stronger than the original one (you can google "kite ferrule" and there are some places to get them from)....
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Allen Carter
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« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2014, 11:03 AM »

The kite store you bought from should be able to replace that, maybe even have a stronger alternative. That really shouldn't be so bendable!

If the replacement doesn't seem stronger, then you might consider augmenting with an internal ferrule of some sort. A carbon rod or tube that goes inside the spar to provide extra strength at the joint. Wouldn't need to be very long, but as weight isn't much of an issue with so big a kite, 12" or so would be OK. Gluing the ferrule in one spar would be permanent, but would make the rod longer than maybe would fit in the bag or something. All you'd really need to do is make sure the ferrule couldn't slide down in the spar, so gluing a narrow ring (like a 1/8" cutoff of the spar material) at the mid point to the ferrule would work and it would be removable and still fit inside the external ferrule.
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Mikey1
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« Reply #5 on: June 04, 2014, 11:17 AM »

the aluminum bent part is glued to one of the rods, so im not sure i can get it off, or how to even go about trying to do so,

i have emailed the manufacturer, no reply, and no surprise here  Roll Eyes

i dont care how strong the winds are, these should be built to withstand it, the nylon and stitching should rip apart before anything like this happens,

i am a very handy guy, i have tried for over an hour to bend it back with a large screwdriver and other various tools, it is much better now but not perfect,

i would say its still bent maybe 2-3 degrees which is alot better but still bent, also the other rod will now not fully insert, it probably has about 1/4 inch left to slide it which it will not,

do you think this will affect its flight?
« Last Edit: June 04, 2014, 11:19 AM by Mikey1 » Logged
thief
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« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2014, 11:26 AM »

i would not use the ferrule again....aluminum can get cracks in it from being bent and it could cause a catastrophic event next time.....

okay..so....to remove a metal ferrule from a carbon or fiberglass rod you need heat....but gentle heat....very gentle heat....if you happen to cook it too much you will burn the resin out of the rod and then rod will be worthless....
i would slowly rotate the ferrule over a candle to heat it evenly and then pull the ferrule with a pair of pliers (it is going to get hot of course) to slip it off...you might then want to sand the old glue off and make sure a new one fits...and then to reassemble with a new dribble super glue (i like Zap-A-Gap best because it is also a gap filling glue) inside the ferrule...then spin the rod into the ferrule and that will spread the glue around....let it sit for a bit to harden and you should be good...

what company made it?   there might be a forum member who works there and be able to quicken up the response...
i have a vague recollection of seeing the aluminum ferrule taped on with electrical tape being from GoFly......but...that was a while back...
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Mikey1
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« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2014, 11:34 AM »

i would not use the ferrule again....aluminum can get cracks in it from being bent and it could cause a catastrophic event next time.....

okay..so....to remove a metal ferrule from a carbon or fiberglass rod you need heat....but gentle heat....very gentle heat....if you happen to cook it too much you will burn the resin out of the rod and then rod will be worthless....
i would slowly rotate the ferrule over a candle to heat it evenly and then pull the ferrule with a pair of pliers (it is going to get hot of course) to slip it off...you might then want to sand the old glue off and make sure a new one fits...and then to reassemble with a new dribble super glue (i like Zap-A-Gap best because it is also a gap filling glue) inside the ferrule...then spin the rod into the ferrule and that will spread the glue around....let it sit for a bit to harden and you should be good...

what company made it?   there might be a forum member who works there and be able to quicken up the response...
i have a vague recollection of seeing the aluminum ferrule taped on with electrical tape being from GoFly......but...that was a while back...

thanks, i will try to remove it by doing that,

the kite is made by "Into The Wind", but i bought it from "Cobra Kites"

it is a 12 foot highlighter delta, it has the "Into The Wind" logo right on the kite

just brainstorming here, but would plumbers glue work?

the type they use on PVC or ABS pipes that smells like it could knock you out?
« Last Edit: June 04, 2014, 11:37 AM by Mikey1 » Logged
Steve
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« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2014, 11:53 AM »

you need a new 10mm (.401 in.) ferrule.

You should be able to get a replacement from ITW or Cobra Kites ... if not goodwinds.com carries them.
it is not uncommon for ferrules to bend if they are fully seated on to the rods. always double check that all fittings are properly connected ... particularly important on large, hard-pulling kites.

As thief said DO NOT straighten and reuse the ferrule as it would be a shame to damage the sail over a $2-$3 part
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Mikey1
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« Reply #9 on: June 04, 2014, 12:10 PM »

you need a new 10mm (.401 in.) ferrule.

You should be able to get a replacement from ITW or Cobra Kites ... if not goodwinds.com carries them.
it is not uncommon for ferrules to bend if they are fully seated on to the rods. always double check that all fittings are properly connected ... particularly important on large, hard-pulling kites.

As thief said DO NOT straighten and reuse the ferrule as it would be a shame to damage the sail over a $2-$3 part

are these specifically made just for kites?

or could i find some kind of store locally that sells them?
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thief
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« Reply #10 on: June 04, 2014, 01:40 PM »

you can find ferrules made out of brass or aluminum....and yes, most are made out of just ordinary tubing.....and makers have figured out which ones are the strongest and use them (i know that i have found some nice looking brass and aluminum tubing at my local hardware store that was crap as a ferrule)...
usually the ferrule is in position to hold two rods end-to-end in a straight line...and that can be a slithgly thinner wall tube...but where the ferrule you have is used to hold rods end-to-end this one (as you have seen) can also get some bending forces at play...so..a thicker wall was needed....

if you take some measurements of the spreaders diameter and the thickness of the wall of the ferrule you have you might be able to search out some tubing material that will provide a thicker wall...because this is on a good sized delta you could find some brass that might weigh more but that will not make a difference to this kite...

ITW is a very good, well known, long time kite company...I am certain that they will make it up to you...
Cobra Kites, is Ray and Jeanne Merry, Ray designed the Flexifoil kites that people love to have drag them around.....I am surprised that they have not responded already too....
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nckiter
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« Reply #11 on: June 04, 2014, 02:02 PM »

Another option if you continue to bend ferrules is to use and inner on one section of your spine and an outer ferrule on the other section. When you slide them together you basically have sandwiched your spine between two ferrules. Like Thief said, this size kite a little added weight is not going to be an issue.

I would stay away from the plumbers glue for ABS or PVC pipe. However 2 part epoxy is a favorite among many kite builders, also Gorilla brand now has a "flexible" CA (super glue) glue that withstands shock loads better that some of the traditional CA glues.
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Mikey1
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« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2014, 08:56 AM »


ITW is a very good, well known, long time kite company...I am certain that they will make it up to you...


the jury is still in deliberations about that decision,

i emailed ITW two days ago, still no reply
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Mikey1
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« Reply #13 on: June 07, 2014, 10:56 AM »

three business days, two emails sent, no reply  Roll Eyes
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thief
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« Reply #14 on: June 07, 2014, 06:01 PM »

sometimes a phone call works best in these situations...
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