GWTW Forum
April 23, 2014, 10:55 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News:
 
   Home   Help Forum Info Login Register Chat  
Welcome to the GWTW Forum.
Guests (non-registered users) can view the forum but are unable to post.  If you don't have anything to say then why would you bother to register?
One of the most popular sections of the GWTW Forum has long been the Swap Meet.  A great place to sell old, seldom flown kites or to get great deals on used (gently flown) kites.  Only registered users can see the Swap Meet section, let alone wheel and deal.  1000's (literally) of kites have changed hands thanks to the Swap Meet.
There are several more benefits to being a registered user, but you'll have to join our little community to find out all the "secrets".
Questions or concerns?  forum.gwtwkites@gmail.com

Pages: [1] 2   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: So, If You Beat A Dead Horse Long Enough  (Read 2848 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
chilese
Global Moderator
Trade Count: (+5)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2896


Location: Las Vegas, NV

WWW
« on: July 19, 2009, 10:31 PM »

At the Friday Night Fly, my quest for the Taz Machine was once again in view. Darren (fidelio) and I have been attempting that particular trick on Fridays and separately on our own flying fields on other days.

I have watched RandyG's excellent video several times, but still had not done a TM of any form.

Friday, with a borrowed Widow Maker UL, I got 3 wobbly Taz Machine's including one which had 2 3/4 wobbly rotations.

Don't know what I was doing different, and was surprised my initial success was on a UL.

I'm sure many of you have long worked on a particular trick and then, BANG, it was there. What intangible is it which allows completion?

I still can't comete, and I'm a bit scared to even try the TM again, fearing I'll have to hang my hat on the fact that it was the kite which allowed the feat.

PS. Darren also got his first TM shortly after me. That guy can't let me have any solo success.   Cool

Logged

John Chilese: Las Vegas, NV
http://picasaweb.google.com/chilesej
JimB
Global Moderator
Trade Count: (+6)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1116


Location: NYC

« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2009, 10:38 PM »

ULs are generally good for the Taz.
Logged
Dano
Trade Count: (+7)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 614

Location: Sparks, Nevada

« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2009, 10:41 PM »

Darren also got his first TM shortly after me. That guy can't let me have any solo success.   Cool

That sounds like Darren.  Cheesy

p.s. It's been HOT here. You guys must be burning. I didn't even fly today. But that's probably due to 2 weeks in the backyard every day building a patio cover. It's finally catching up to me all that sun.

I heard Berkeley was nice and cool today though, hopefully next weekend too.  Smiley
« Last Edit: July 19, 2009, 10:45 PM by Dano » Logged
sbrown
Trade Count: (+4)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 123

Location: Vancouver Island/Steveston BC, Canada

WWW
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2009, 11:04 PM »

Of course you did the Taz Machine with your left and right handed, didn't you?  Undecided

It took me 3 years to learn the backspin. It wasn't until I gave up 'trying' and just thought, what the heck, I'll just give it a pull with the other hand and see what it does. The I2K spun happily around on its back.  Huh
« Last Edit: July 20, 2009, 10:40 AM by sbrown » Logged

Sent from my 6 year old laptop using Hunt'n'Peck.
hdegive
Trade Count: (0)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 15

Location:

« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2009, 11:27 PM »

An UL? I'll have to try that. The greatest inspiration is often born of desperation Roll Eyes

Logged
Beachbum
Guest
Trade Count: (0)
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2009, 11:35 PM »

Nice Job Mr. Chilese.

I think the intangible your asking about is actually hand eye coordination and muscle memory.

Logged
fidelio
Trade Count: (+7)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1061


Location: las vegas

« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2009, 01:52 AM »

if we don't push eachother to get better, who will?
i'll admit kent's sweet custom widow maker ul has some magic built in though.

while you were admiring your nephew doing 360's with an 8 meter foil, i was quietly doing a bunch more tazzez. Tongue

my intent was to get enough under my belt so they'd be there when i tried to transfer the trick to another kite. guess we'll see if it worked next friday.

it's great to see you doing something new as the discovery seems to bring you real joy, especially the taz machine since it's such a cool trick.
Logged

Fdeli
obijuankenobe
Trade Count: (+1)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 419


Location: Barendrecht, Nederland

« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2009, 03:34 AM »

Unfortunately, I think you'll both find that learning the taz on one kite (esp. one rumored to give them away like the WM) will not transfer to other kites at all.  Much like the comete, the taz machine takes some inputs which can be incredibly kite specific.  I can comete my Sea Devils, and even occasionally reverse them.  I still can't comete the Cosmic very well in the 'good' direction. 

The Cosmic also can do a beautiful taz machine at an 80% clip once you figure out what the kite wants.  The Sea Devil, for me, not so much.  The XTs, for me, not so much.  In fact, this lame-o pilot has yet to pull of a nice taz on the XTs.  Roll Eyes

What you need to think more about for this trick is what position the kite reaches (at the point of the spin input) when you get those 'WOW' taz machines, and look to achieve that position on these other kites.  This will be more productive for you than trying to remember the inputs (i.e. hand position, strength of input, etc.) which worked on the WM.

That being said, it really is a great maneuver when done well. 

Just my two cents,
obi
Logged

"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return." L daVinci
randyg
Trade Count: (+4)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 241


Location: Georgia

« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2009, 05:21 AM »

Instead of flying horizontal to enter the trick, try flying at a slight downward angle to enter. And yes, UL's can be very good at this trick.
Logged

DWayne
Trade Count: (+10)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1356


Location: Corning, Ca.

« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2009, 06:08 AM »

Good one John. I too got my first Taz on a WM. I struggled getting them on the Talons at first. But after I got the initial input down, they started coming much more frequently. Though I've yet to get one on the vent I did get my first tip stand to Taz launch on the UL a couple of days ago.

Denny
Logged

I always wanted to be a procrastinator..........
I just never got around to it.
lylenc
Trade Count: (+1)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 249

Location: Walla Walla, WA

« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2009, 07:17 AM »

Backspin was my challenge. I spent about three months combined over two years focusing on that trick, with a bunch of other half-hearted attempts for other months. Every now and then I'd get some revolutions, but due to the variable winds and time between successes, I couldn't figure out what I did correctly when it did work. Eventually, it all came together.

Tony, Pug, used to fly frequently and was a fast learner, but I haven't seen him much for two years. He has excellent hand-eye coordination from wood carving and stone engraving. One day I was driving by the kite field after work and saw him trying out a new kite, Sea Devil I think. I hiked out to let him show it off and commented that his fade was set-up for a backspin. He tried a couple of times, had me show him a couple, and about his third or fourth attempt in a ten minute period, he nailed some. It was about as thrilling for me as him.

In two seasons, he advanced beyond my capabilities. I'm hoping he didn't burn out. I'd much rather be the second best flyer on the field than the only flyer.
Logged

Craig     Walla Walla, WA     Just One More!
fidelio
Trade Count: (+7)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1061


Location: las vegas

« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2009, 09:47 AM »

obi, i agree. which is why for me it's important to replicate success on the spot if i can because more important than the inputs is seeing the kite do the trick, in person, experiencing the wind conditions.

in my trials so far the finesse of the inputs changes as much with wind conditions and strength as it does with a particular kite, but a trick executed well on one kite on one day, should look the same as the same trick executed well on another kite on another day.

for this reason once "i can see the trick", meaning i have a slight grasp of it, having done it successfully repeatedly on one day, on one kite, then it's much easier for me to chase the trick down on another kite. it's much easier for me to recognize the necessary changes in inputs in order to achieve positioning of the kite throughout various stages of a trick, once i've experienced it first hand. it could take days, weeks, or months in order to get the first one (of a particular trick), but after just a few, the rest come much easier.

i don't know if others share this phenomenon but it's absolutely true for me.

an example of this is i'd flown a deep space for a year, and had found it nearly impossible to perform a certain trick. but only a week after randyg sent me a nirvana i was able to grasp the same trick i'd had such trouble with. fast forward a few months and i'm now able to do the same trick on the deep space which had eluded me for a year. the nirvana has taught me many, many things, not the least of which is how to fly and more greatly appreciate my deep space.

having access to kites which give tricks away to me has been of great benefit in learning those tricks on kites which don't give them away so easily.

i'm certainly no great flyer, and find great challenge in the act, but the relaxation and freedom i find at the end of the lines is nothing short of intoxicating.
Logged

Fdeli
fidelio
Trade Count: (+7)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1061


Location: las vegas

« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2009, 09:59 AM »

i'm also very lucky and grateful to have a nirvana which belonged to, and was therefor tuned by randyg. thanks randy. Kiss

apparently i'm the proud owner of the only nirvana mr chilese likes. Cool

speaking of kites which give tricks away though, what are the tricks and kites which you feel are giveaways?

me for the giveaways are:

nirvana - jacobs ladder
deep space - double axle
quantum pro - comete
shadow - multi slot machine
Logged

Fdeli
DavidS
Trade Count: (0)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 14

Location:

« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2009, 12:43 PM »

On the right day (right wind), I can get a sloppy Taz - but it remains elusive.

There have been several days that I can hit a comete with apparent little effort - then the next day, I can't find it at all...

Gives me a good excuse to go out and practice more.

-DavidS

Logged
Gamelord
Trade Count: (+2)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 564


Location: Las Vegas, Nevada

WWW
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2009, 03:11 PM »

You NEED an excuse?  Cheesy Cheesy
Logged

Pages: [1] 2   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  


items purchased through the links below help support the forum

Our forum is made possible by the good folks whose ads appear in the right margin of the forum and by the members of our community (PayPal donation button at bottom of the page)
In case you missed it each ad is linked to the sponsors web site.  So please, take a moment and visit our sponsors sites as this forum wouldn't be possible with out them. >>>
Interested in running an ad for your business or kiting event?  Contact Steve at advertise.gwtwkites@gmail.com for a quote.


member support is greatly appreciated!

Cal Custom
kitekids.net



Untitled Document
J Hall Photography

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.8 | SMF © 2006-2008, Simple Machines LLC
SimplePortal 2.2.1 © 2008-2009
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!