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Author Topic: Norton Internet Security  (Read 2024 times)
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mikenchico
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« on: January 12, 2010, 06:27 PM »

OK, I bought a new mini, Toshiba Satellite T115-S1100 with Win 7, all the features I wanted except it came with Norton's installed. On first boot I ran the removal tool and all seemed to go OK at first. The computer rebooted and connected to my network & the internet fine and took me directly to the Norton site to beg me to re-install it. Of course I declined, Norton then proceeded to destroy my network and internet connections. Not just on that particular computer but on all 5 computers!!!

It closed the wireless connection between my Digital Path wireless modem & Digital Path's wireless hub, it closed the wired connection between my router and the wireless modem, it closed the connections between two wired computers and three wireless computers to my router and left me with absolutly NO connectivity on or between any of my computers. All modems, routers and hubs are Linksys.

After rebooting everything and re-configuring everything I got 3 of the 5 computers back up but still have had no success with the two that had Norton's pre-installed.

Does anybody know what files Norton's leaves on your computers to continue "bending you over", And how to get rid of them?

Thanks

« Last Edit: January 12, 2010, 06:34 PM by mikenchico » Logged

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RobB
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« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2010, 07:08 PM »

I've never seen anything like that happen. I remove Norton all the time. It's standard procedure when we start working on a new location, remove all existing AV software, and install the same product, same version on all workstations that are worth saving.
I don't get it... if you're removing it on one machine, why would that effect the other network devices ? It just doesn't follow... I think you've got something else going on in your network. Sounds like coincidence to me... And I've never seen Norton's come back and ask you to re-install the product, you sure the website was a Symantec website ?

~Rob.
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mikenchico
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« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2010, 08:31 PM »

Yep auto opened IE and went to Norton's.

I've never had it shut down everything either, even routers, the problem with the other PC's was probably when the router went offline.

Immediately after closing the Norton's site all the computers lost their internet connection and connection to each other. Rebooting the router didn't fix the internet connections since the Digital Path unit on my roof had also had it's connection to the Digital Path hub across the street shut down. Rebooting it then rebooting my router brought back the Internet connection on all computers, but neither of the PC's that had Norton's on them at one time can log onto the home network anymore. They see it and a couple of the computers but not all 5 and if I try to access the shares I get an "incorrect password" message on the win7 machine and a "you don't have permission" message on the win xp machine. I have had this network up for 8 years through 3 different routers and switches so I'm pretty sure I know the password and work group names.

I'm assuming Norton's modifies a Windows .dll file and stays resident and I'll need to replace that .dll with the original windows unmodified version but I have no idea which one and have been unsuccessful finding the info.

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« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2010, 03:31 AM »

OK, I have to write the Digital path crash off to bad coincidence. Unless you run some sort of client connection software for the DP unit... Is your router/DP unit just a gateway ? Or do you run some sort of Linksys/DP client software ? I'm assumming that DP is some sort of microwave ISP in your area.
Do you use static addresses on your network ? You should, if the machines came back with different addresses after the netwark crashed, that could explain why they're acting all stupid, like they don't know each other. Oh, that's another assumption, that you're not running anything crazy in your network... no servers, no active directory ?

It really doesn't sound like a piece of software did this, if it were the Norton, it would only affect the one machine in question. I would look at other reasons why your network crashed. Do you have all of your hubs/routers/switches/modems plugged into a battery backup ? The more complex your network, the more important good power is.

Your problem with logging into shares may be that the Win7 machine  isn't passing your credentials the way you intend it to, or that the removal of Norton has re-enabled your Windows firewall. If your host machine is prompting you for a username/password when you try to access the share, use the syntax hostmachinename\username. It maybe that win7 and vista would pass clientmachinename\username, causing a bad username/password response from the host machine. Vista and Win7 really suck in the peer to peer networking department. Life was so much easier before Vista...
So, static addresses all around, and get yourself some battery backups if you don't have them all ready. Once you get the network put back together, it will be more reliable going down the road.
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indigo_wolf
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« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2010, 06:49 AM »

Have you already tried the Norton Removal Tool?
http://service1.symantec.com/Support/tsgeninfo.nsf/docid/2005033108162039

Sometimes Windows Uninstall doesn't catch everything.

ATB,
Sam
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mikenchico
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« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2010, 01:15 PM »

*Sam, yes that's how I removed it, the very first time I turned on the computer and before even allowing Norton's to activate the free trial.

*Must - Yes everything is on a battery back-up, not even 6 months old yet. I did find something on the Win7 machine, it originally accessed the other computers fine on the boot after immediately after removing Norton's and dismissing that auto pop open of IE to download Norton's. At some point though the Win7 machine was re-assigned as a member of a domain rather then a  workgroup, I fixed that but still no joy. Since all the PC's are not assigned static IP's but let the router assign them, I may need to reboot all around again, I'll give that a try.

If that doesn't work does Win7 include the command line utility 'netsh' ? Guess it repairs the TCP/IP stack & Winsock, I found info that that usually repairs Norton's damage, but all the references to it are for Win XP.

Quote
Reset TCP/IP stack to installation defaults, type: netsh int ip reset reset.log

Reset WINSOCK entries to installation defaults, type: netsh winsock reset catalog

Guess I could do a search huh?

No special connection software on the Toshiba like on this Thinkpad, I hate this Lenovo/IBM connection manager thing, makes a stupid simple job an hour of selecting options, but it didn't like it when I killed it from loading.

No software involved with Digital Path, they mount a wireless unit on the roof and point it at their repeater and run a cat5 cable into your house and to your computer or a router, good for 5-10 miles reception at 3.5 mbs and I'm under 200 yards direct line of sight from it, trouble free except when my 2.4g rooftop unit went down once, they replaced it with a new 5.8g unit and no drops for 3-4 months now except when they do maintainence, that never requires a reboot on my end though, be quite an improbable co-incidence but it could happen.

I have a new in the box XP Pro SP2 and a corporate XP Pro slipstreamed to SP3, have seriously thought a few times about wiping everything back to pure XP & Office Pro 2007 and be done with all the proprietary and trial software headaches. I miss the days you could build your own for the same price you could buy one, but you can't build a laptop at home.

I just know Norton's messes with my network, even after uninstall, Rhonda's laptop originally could connect fine then it quit, I removed Norton's and magically there was the network in seconds with no problems .... for a month or so then all connections disappeared again although she can access the internet and somehow still print to a printer on another computer even though she can't see that computer. I can access her computer from any other though so I just push any files she needs to her rather then her pulling them. A pain but not as bad as running a "Sneaker Net" on floppies like the old days.

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"Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see" John W Lennon

"People do not quit playing because they grow old, they grow old because they quit playing" George Bernard Shaw
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« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2010, 01:30 PM »

Win 7 does include netsh.   Some of the sub-commands have changed (most notably "diag"  Cry), but INTerface looks to be the same.

ATB,
Sam
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mikenchico
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« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2010, 01:58 PM »

Thanks Sam, I do need to try that on Rhonda's anyway, it's XP. Not connecting to the two desktops isn't a big deal anymore since they are hardly used but one has the printer and the other a backup drive so it's nice.

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« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2010, 06:47 PM »

all laptop I've bought I've simply format and reinstalled the os from scratch, wiping all the crud away.

a much better experience is guaranteed for all !
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RobB
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« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2010, 07:35 PM »


OK, this is just getting really bizarre. Did you join the machine to a domain on purpose ? That doesn't just happen on its own, you have to authenticate to the domain in order to join it. If you were joined to the domain, you are subject to all of the domain policies that are in effect on the domain controller. That could account for your user credentials being AFU in your workgroup environment. I suppose...
It sounds like you have been pretty well immersed in windows networking, and should be able to use this as kind of a check list of best practices...
-a static IP for any machine that is sharing a resource.
-a mapped drive connection on any client that is accessing a shared folder on another machine.
-matched user names and passwords on all workgroup machines
-I like to map my drive connections by using the IP of the machine\resource name (192.168.1.100\share)
-check the permissions and security tabs in the shared folder properties to make sure that the assigned users are individually assigned rights to the resource. Don't rely on assigning permissions to a group (users, power users, etc). Be granular, define each user in question.

You have battery back-ups... so many people don't recognize the importance of that. We don't sell equipment without one, even if the customer has an isolated ground outlet, they get a battery.

Your ISP provides your internet the same way I tie together corparate intranets. I am actually installing a point-point tomorrow, to tie in a 10 user network in a separte building to the rest of a corparate network in the main building. I've heard that ISPs use the microwave equipment for getting internet to their customers, but never come across an actual implementation of it. Seems like a very expensive initial start-up for each client, did you have to buy your own roof equipment, or do they lease it to you ? The 100 meg PTP that I'm doing tomorrow is 8-10 grand, our cost, and it's not really even true 100 meg.

Good luck putting the network back together, hopefully some of my suggestions will help to make it more reliable for you.
~Rob.
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mikenchico
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« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2010, 07:51 PM »

usually a $200-250 hook-up fee in rural area's, $50 in town, being the first to call once they got setup we got in on a $100 inital hook-up with a full refund for 30 days if not pleased.

They are a local company that has developed their own equipment and do sell it to anybody wanting to start their own internet service to otherwise unreachable areas. A nice feature for me is you get a roaming log-on, anywhere you see a digitalpath repeater you can connect, they use standard B,G,N frequencies and protocalls so you don't actually need that rooftop unit if you are close enough. The reciever though is what get's them the distance although it's just a 6" square box. Each rooftop unit also acts as a repeater so I can log-on through DP.com (The main hubs) or DP.net (anybodies rooftop unit) I usually only have to drive a few blocks to find a signal here in Chico.

Oh and for $10 a month more I can get 1 or 2 phone lines and for $20 a month I can get a second roaming only account so I don't kick home offline if I log-on while roaming. Home service, equipment, taxes & fees is $42.95 rural, $32.95 local, Rural is 3 mps down (I get 3.5) and 700kps up (I get 1 mbs), local is 6mbs down 1 mbs up. They'll provide a router & firewall if needed no extra charge but I had my own so declined. It's the future if they can get it expanded beyond nor cal IMO.


« Last Edit: January 13, 2010, 08:15 PM by mikenchico » Logged

"Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see" John W Lennon

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Fast EDDY
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« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2010, 12:08 AM »

 Hey

  O K  so Windows 7.0 and your Issues may also be a Two way street... YOu have probably been told that 7.0 would run software  like Vista and XP just fine. THIS IS NOT A FACT!!! While Beta testing the new 7.0 our group of people found that Over Half of the software would CRASH and Colide within itself and cause Numerous Problems...

  The ANSWER to the issue that we found was the UPGRADE to 7.0 Pro  which has the Interface that allows Vista and XP to run right on top of 7.0 It stop all our system crashes among the software that we were testing. From routers to just Basic software. Now Granted this May not be the case in point for you. However it ,ight solve a lot of your problems.

   Something to think about as a whole. and ask questions about at your local high end TECH SUPPORT place.

  Fast EDDY 
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mikenchico
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« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2010, 08:44 AM »

No old software installed yet, brand new, I've done nothing but get rid of the Trialware, but thanks for the pointer to Pro being more compatible if I should need to use any of my older stuff, I've resigned myself to having to update my favorite graphics program but a little utility called PicaView is also indespenable to me, it was made for Win95, so far it's worked fine but I'm scared Win7 won't like it and no replacement has ever been made. I honestly don't think it can be set to run in compatibilty mode either though since it is a context menu hack and single .dll photo info, viewer & converter.

I haven't fought anymore with it yet, I got it to the point it can access my wireless connected computers, just not the two wired computers & it connects to the internet so my basic requirements are met. It's just not 100% and that will bug me.

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"Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see" John W Lennon

"People do not quit playing because they grow old, they grow old because they quit playing" George Bernard Shaw
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