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Author Topic: Kite pricing  (Read 2463 times)
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Geoffrey Platt
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« on: November 10, 2010, 07:12 AM »

Hey everyone!

It's been a while since I've really posted anything on the forum. I have been extremely busy with our first daughter Kayla who will be a year old in December. So needless to say I have not had a lot of flying time this past year. But I am slowly getting a lite more time and have been slowly finding some time to get a few kites out of the bag.

One of the things I have been and am curious about is how we value and price our prized kites. Like the Nirvana Debray Edition I posted at $350 which I then decided to put back in my bag. Why is it only worth $350 when it's retail was $500 and there were only 24 made? Wouldn't you think it would be worth more because of it's rarity? Or how about a rare signed Berkley edition Prism? Or a first build Benson Phantom? Or any other special kite for that matter. I am more curious then anything. There are many other hobbies that gain value over time like card games or stamp collecting or coin collecting etc.. Why do our collectors editions go down in price instead of up in price? Possible due to lack of demand?? Just thought this would be an interesting topic to cover..
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Geoffrey Platt
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« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2010, 08:02 AM »

Why do our collectors editions go down in price instead of up in price? Possible due to lack of demand?? Just thought this would be an interesting topic to cover..
Because our "collectors" are generally flown and therefore suffer associated wear, tear, stretching, fading, wrinkling etc etc.

Your kite for instance, its not pristine is it ? I'm sure its still very nice, but its not unflown and crispy, hell, its not even original specification anymore - given than you've swapped out the standoffs (and yes I understand this is a fairly minor detail).

I'm sure that if somebody lists an unflown Debray Nirvana they could get more than the $500 they originally they invested.

In fact ... if there is such a kite out there ... I'll pay more than $500 for it.


« Last Edit: November 10, 2010, 03:25 PM by in.divi.dual » Logged
Craig
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« Reply #2 on: November 10, 2010, 08:20 AM »

You set the price, no one else!
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in.divi.dual
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« Reply #3 on: November 10, 2010, 08:24 AM »

You set the price, no one else!

Thats absolutely true, you can ask whatever you want for it.

However speculating on used kites is not a particularly sound investment strategy.

« Last Edit: November 10, 2010, 08:26 AM by in.divi.dual » Logged
lylenc
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« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2010, 08:33 AM »

The weak economy and the small universe of kite addicts probably have more impact on price than a kite being a collectible luxury item. There isn't much "wow" factor in showing off a kite to the luxury crowd - few to none kite snobs out there in the luxury crowd.

A couple of weeks ago, a financial news show had a wine appraiser and a wine investor as guests. The investor had just paid at auction $100s of thoushands for a 100+ year old bottle of wine - only three bottles left. The appraiser and investor were there to justify the wisdom of the investment and price. That type of market is not the kite world.
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Craig     Walla Walla, WA     Just One More!
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« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2010, 08:56 AM »

At the last Whidbey Island Kite Swap Tent, it seemed like supply exceeded demand.

Some fairly collectable kites at very low prices got no offers.

Even at $10 with Indoor lines, I couldn't sell a Buena Vista X4i. It wasn't until I bundled it with an HQ Geenie@ $30 that I got an offer.
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thief
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« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2010, 09:23 AM »

Even at $10 with Indoor lines, I couldn't sell a Buena Vista X4i. It wasn't until I bundled it with an HQ Geenie@ $30 that I got an offer.

ARGH!!!!!!! did you take that offer????i would pay that and shipping!!!!!!!shyte..........

Look at the world of Synchros...supply and demand...and toss in some rumors/personal experience and you get a synchro that sells for 500$.....and some that sometimes at 350$ do not sell...and then some people asking 700$ or more.....
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Kites kayaks & corgis again!!!
indigo_wolf
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« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2010, 09:25 AM »

On PKF there are kites that have probably only seen less than a handful of flights and like new condition (knowing some of the sellers) that have had hundreds of dollars knocked of the MSRP and in some cases the original asking price.  In some cases, some of the are still shuffling their bridles and languishing on the selling block.

We are also moving into the season of  non-kite (Huh) gift giving season.  Brutal heating oil prices are going to nuke some discretionary funds too.

That last bit is going to have a big impact too.  In a climate where salary freezes are common while the coast of everything else is going up, the kite fund is going to be sadly curtailed in some instances where it might not have a few years ago.

ATB,
Sam
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indigo_wolf
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« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2010, 09:28 AM »

Even at $10 with Indoor lines, I couldn't sell a Buena Vista X4i. It wasn't until I bundled it with an HQ Geenie@ $30 that I got an offer.


That's a such a purty X4i.....  Cry  Cry  Cry

ATB,
Sam
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cids
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« Reply #9 on: November 10, 2010, 09:29 AM »

MJ or Jacko makes more $$$ after he was dead.  The problem is Debray is still young and looks very very healthy.  You have a lot of waiting to do.  Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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lylenc
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« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2010, 12:08 PM »

I couldn't remember the wine price and didn't want to exaggerate ... it was $700,000.

"Last week three bottles of 1869 Lafite Rothschild (Chateau Stock) sold at Sothbys HK for over $700,000 US dollars."

I hope they can party hard on each drop. Might have to loan the guy some beer to finish the party.

http://www.sokolin.com/articles/Staff-Review-Articles.aspx?id=89
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Craig     Walla Walla, WA     Just One More!
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« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2010, 12:21 PM »

Value is in the eyes of the beholder.....unfortunately, not everyone has the same eyes. Smiley
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randyg
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« Reply #12 on: November 10, 2010, 01:05 PM »

As others have said, you set the price and really didn't give the used kite buying public much of a chance to make a purchase decision before pulling it off the market. I'm assuming you're not one of those members here that gets frustrated only hours after posting a kite for sale if you don't start getting pm's. Kiss The one or two I've seen be sold have gone for around $400 IIRC.

The market sets the price. The market is down...way, way down. If the kite had stayed on the market a little longer I'll bet it would have sold at your price. I even know a certain nice fellow that was arm wrestling with himself over the decision. Grin But it is a 6 year old kite so macro pics of the typical wear areas would assuage those that would hesitate to spend that much dough on a used kite. Also remember those sticks will run you just shy of $200 for the set. If you don't have a spare and the potential buyer doesn't as well, that is another consideration to factor into the purchase decision.
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Bob D
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« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2010, 01:33 PM »

It's up to the buyer to decide how much they'll pay. I paid a chunk of change for a custom Team Next Up and probably over 3 bills for the Nirvana WW. The R-Sky's are worth it to me. So I guess it depends on whether the buyer thinks it's "worth it". (I also paid over 400 for an unflown custom Fearless too. To me, that's worth it too. I WAS thinking about the Tattoo that was for sale but I have too many kites in the bag that don't see a lot of air time since I've been focusing on the Nirvanas.)

BTW, the Debray is a beautiful kite and I'd like to see it stay on this side of the Atlantic considering there's so few of them here.
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Bob D.
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« Reply #14 on: November 10, 2010, 04:39 PM »

WEll here's my take on this subject.  First off kites are not particularly collectable. You can't expect kites to fetch money used like classic cars, art or any of the other main stream collectables.  It is a VERY small niche market of enthusiast and can be more compared to the beanie baby craze or pogs or any of a host of fad/trendy items than true collectables.  Used kites are never in pristine condition and often not even original and as far as value goes you can liken it to the used car market in that even a never flown kite thats a few years old is still a used kite unless its packaging has never been opened. Another thing to consider is kites do degrade over time and unlike a lot of collectables can not be restored to "like new" condition without completely remaking the kite.

The biggest thing to remember is any used item is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Be it kites, cars, dolls, furniture or whatever.  You can set a price you want but if no one is willing to pay it then its not worth that price.
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