GWTW Forum
December 21, 2014, 04:06 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News:
 
   Home   Help Forum Info Login Register Chat  
Welcome to the GWTW Forum.
Guests (non-registered users) can view the forum but are unable to post.  If you don't have anything to say then why would you bother to register?
One of the most popular sections of the GWTW Forum has long been the Swap Meet.  A great place to sell old, seldom flown kites or to get great deals on used (gently flown) kites.  Only registered users can see the Swap Meet section, let alone wheel and deal.  1000's (literally) of kites have changed hands thanks to the Swap Meet.
There are several more benefits to being a registered user, but you'll have to join our little community to find out all the "secrets".
Questions or concerns? Contact Steve ... just drop an email to: forum.gwtwkites@gmail.com

Pages: [1] 2   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Parafoil wont stay up  (Read 2362 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Dwight_Shrut
Trade Count: (0)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 15

Location:

« on: May 31, 2011, 12:28 PM »

I am a complete newbie when it comes to parafoil kites. Picked up my first single line parafoil (HQ easy parafoil) for $20 this weekend. As advertised I pulled the kite out of the bag attached it to the included line using the bridle attachment loop, using the lark head knot (all these things were picked up on the magical youtube). The kite starts to rise but then dips to the left (my right). Then it sort of collapses onto itself and drifts to the ground. Am I doing something wrong. I wanted a single line parafoil so that my 2 year old can hold onto the string for some time without any intervention from me. Please chime in with any questions, suggestions, comments because I really want to make this work.
Logged
Flying Fish
Trade Count: (+6)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 340


Location: UK south coast

WWW
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2011, 12:33 PM »

What was the wind speed when you were trying it? A parafoil like this does need a decent wind, so maybe there just wasn't enough?
Logged

Dwight_Shrut
Trade Count: (0)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 15

Location:

« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2011, 12:37 PM »

Weather.com said it was doing about 18-20 MPH. The kite is rated for 8-31 so I figured it was well within the range
Logged
Flying Fish
Trade Count: (+6)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 340


Location: UK south coast

WWW
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2011, 12:44 PM »

OK, one potential cause ruled out! I don't know exactly how such a kite is bridled, but it sounds as if the leading edge of the kite is too far back, leading to the angle of attack to be too steep. Is there any way you can change the bridle settings and so the angle of attack of the sail?
Logged

Ca Ike
Trade Count: (+24)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1712


Location: Stockton, CA

« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2011, 12:51 PM »


With some of the small "pocket parafoils" you need to really make sure your not close to anything that can create wind turbulance or they will do that and the bridles get twisted up pretty easily where all the lines join so double check before launch..  Also parafoils are the one kite that will not fly true without a tail, especially the small  ones.  I have premiers small foil and prisms stowaway foil and neither on will fly well at all with the tails removed. So if it didn't come with a tail pick up a 10 footer for it.  They also tend to need a good stiff breeze of at least 6 mph to get aloft and will "dance" in gusty conditions.  

As far as small parafoils go out of all the ones I have owned Prisms stowaway has been the best with premiers a close 2nd.
Logged
Ca Ike
Trade Count: (+24)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1712


Location: Stockton, CA

« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2011, 12:55 PM »

OK, one potential cause ruled out! I don't know exactly how such a kite is bridled, but it sounds as if the leading edge of the kite is too far back, leading to the angle of attack to be too steep. Is there any way you can change the bridle settings and so the angle of attack of the sail?
Angle of attack on these is pretty much built in and doesn't need to be adjusted.  However, you can have the bridle twisted up at the attachment loop or one line on the leading edge a bit shorter than the rest.
Logged
Dwight_Shrut
Trade Count: (0)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 15

Location:

« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2011, 01:04 PM »

OK, one potential cause ruled out! I don't know exactly how such a kite is bridled, but it sounds as if the leading edge of the kite is too far back, leading to the angle of attack to be too steep. Is there any way you can change the bridle settings and so the angle of attack of the sail?
Let me try to answer that the best I can since I don't know all the terms. The bridle is attached to the kite at 4 points, two along the spine (near the top and bottom) and two at the edges. The two points along the spine are connected by a single thread and the center of the thread has a knot and a little loop after the knot. Same for the two points along the edges. Both these come together at the center to attach to the bridle loop and to the kite line through that. I have noticed that the center bridle and the edge bridle are not the same length. When I hold the kite at the bridle connection point and let it hang loose,  the kite settles at about 45 degrees angle. Are you saying that it needs to hang perpendicular to the ground?

Another thing, the tail that came with this foil is a single nylon streamer. It connects to the kite at the bottom, one end to the extreme left and other to the extreme right. Am I supposed to measure it and cut it at the center to let both sides of the kite have an independent tail?
« Last Edit: May 31, 2011, 01:30 PM by Dwight_Shrut » Logged
Dwight_Shrut
Trade Count: (0)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 15

Location:

« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2011, 01:09 PM »

I am trying to fly this thing on a school ground which is about 200 * 100 meters and it is ringed by houses. The school building is by far the biggest one and is about 50 meters behind me. Winds were out of the south, and were coming over the school building.

The single tail provided is sewn onto the kite and is about 5-6 meters.

One thing I plan to do today is to take a diamond and a delta today with me along with the parafoil. The diamond flies real nicely when the winds are ok, and that probably might be an indicator of how the winds are.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2011, 01:14 PM by Dwight_Shrut » Logged
Flying Fish
Trade Count: (+6)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 340


Location: UK south coast

WWW
« Reply #8 on: May 31, 2011, 01:42 PM »

Quote
When I hold the kite at the bridle connection point and let it hang loose,  the kite settles at about 45 degrees angle. Are you saying that it needs to hang perpendicular to the ground?

45 degrees sounds about right (definitely shouldn't be perpendicular, as that will prevent it from going up), so another explanation bites the dust! Checking that bridle lines at both sides are of equal length can't hurt, as making sure they're not entangled anywhere. Hmmm, running out of ideas ...
Logged

Dwight_Shrut
Trade Count: (0)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 15

Location:

« Reply #9 on: May 31, 2011, 01:59 PM »


45 degrees sounds about right (definitely shouldn't be perpendicular, as that will prevent it from going up), so another explanation bites the dust! Checking that bridle lines at both sides are of equal length can't hurt, as making sure they're not entangled anywhere. Hmmm, running out of ideas ...
I need to start proof reading my post a bit more carefully. I meant parallel to the ground. I will check length of the bridle lines when I get home. I might just have landed a bad piece. Still plan to try and make it work since now its a challange Tongue. Please post any experimentation that you would like me to try out, based on your experiences. 

Will probably order the prisms stowaway foil that was mentioned earlier in the thread to make sure my two year old does not think dad is a total loser and cant even fly a kite. 

Before I forget: You guys are awesome to respond back so quickly... Thanks.
Logged
Allen Carter
Moderator
Trade Count: (+20)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1857

Location: Half Moon Bay, CA

« Reply #10 on: May 31, 2011, 03:33 PM »

I am trying to fly this thing on a school ground which is about 200 * 100 meters and it is ringed by houses. The school building is by far the biggest one and is about 50 meters behind me. Winds were out of the south, and were coming over the school building.



That sounds like a pretty tough venue. The wind below 20 or 30 feet is going to be unstable. Best to try launching the kite on a long line. Reel out 40' or so of line and have an assistant hold the kite for launch. Pull in line hand over hand to get the kite to rise quickly up to where things are more stable. with good ground wind just about any kite can be launched from your hand and reeled all the way back in again.

In an area surrounded by trees and buildings you can really get a sense of the ground wind when reeling in a kite. At a certain point it gets a squirrelly and crashes.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2011, 03:37 PM by Allen Carter » Logged

Allen, AKA kitehead
Ca Ike
Trade Count: (+24)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1712


Location: Stockton, CA

« Reply #11 on: May 31, 2011, 04:28 PM »

YEp Allen is right.  THat school building is the big culprit and you wouldn't get good wind untill you get above the roof level.  The shortest distance you should try for from a building to your position is 1/4 mile but thats not always possible in most areas so you try to keep the buildings to one side or the other.  If the school is your typical flat top box building then your winds is really going to be crappy below roof level. Look for a spot where the wind would be going alongside the building and it should be better flying, not much but still better.  IN that spot you would want the wind coming over the houses since the roof slopes don't affect the wind as much so look for north, west or east winds and if its south winds IMO look for a new spot Smiley

Logged
Dwight_Shrut
Trade Count: (0)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 15

Location:

« Reply #12 on: May 31, 2011, 07:34 PM »

wind Gods were angry today. Barely 5 miles / hour. Hopefully it will be better tomorrow. I will move away  from the school bldg as much as possible,and do a long line launch with a helper. 

Will keep this thread updated

Thanks
Logged
Lee S
Trade Count: (+4)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 264

Location:

« Reply #13 on: May 31, 2011, 08:41 PM »

I seem to remember from somewhere (maybe an old AKA brochure?) long ago the standard of wind turbulence extending twice as high as the highest object upwind, and at least 3 times the size of the object downwind. So, a tight schoolyard surrounded by trees and buildings puts you and a disadvantage. Added to that is parafoils function best in smooth winds, like you'd find at the beach or in a large park. But, I used to fly a 5 sq ft parafoil as a kid in my neighborhood elementary school yard, long before I knew I shouldn't, and had a blast. I remember the first 100 ft or so being a real challenge. I would check the bridle for any obvious flaws by laying the kite flat on the ground, maybe weighting it down flat, and holding the bridle tow point directly above the mid-line of the kite. It should look even. Beyond that, just experiment. Long line launches are a good idea. Pull as smooth as possible.

Maybe as a second kite you would consider a framed kite. Prism makes a great diamond, as do most of the major makers. Gimmick shapes make kites harder to fly. Keep that in mind as your 2 year old eyes the dinosaur shaped kite. Wink Delta kites almost always work well. You might also consider either a Prism Triad, or a Popcan. Those kites are meant to be less stable, so you can make all that diving and swooping look like it's intentional.

Smooth winds, as usual,

Lee
Logged
Ca Ike
Trade Count: (+24)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1712


Location: Stockton, CA

« Reply #14 on: June 01, 2011, 03:48 PM »

The affect of an object on wind turbulence depends more on  its shape than size.  A brick wall will have a greater affect than  a chain link fence for example.  THe rule of 3 times the height extending down wind is pretty close  but use your senses as they will tell you more than anything else.  IF your near a building and your hair is blowing all over then your in the turbulence if its blowing in one relatively steady direction then the wind is ok.
Logged
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  


kmacFab
kmacFab

Kite Classifieds Ad
Kite Classifieds

A Wind Of Change
A Wind Of Change

Untitled Document
Untitled Document

Kite Classifieds Ad
Fly Market

A Wind Of Change
skyshark

Kitebookie
Kitebookie.com

Untitled Document

Untitled Document
Untitled Document

Our forum is made possible by the good folks whose ads appear above and by the members of our community (PayPal donation button at bottom)
In case you missed it each ad is linked to the sponsors web site.  So please, take a moment and visit our sponsors sites as this forum wouldn't be possible with out them.
Interested in running an ad for your business or kiting event?  Contact Steve at advertise.gwtwkites@gmail.com for a quote.

Cal Custom

Support the GWTW Forum

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.8 | SMF © 2006-2008, Simple Machines LLC
SimplePortal 2.2.1 © 2008-2009
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!