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Author Topic: Super special magic parts  (Read 2466 times)
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rncembal
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« on: May 31, 2011, 01:49 PM »

After reading in another thread about customer service I think it fair to say most kites don't use the above. It is correct that a kite new in the package should come complete and intact. You faithful readers and endusers should know that fixes are closer and easier than you think . An HQ part for a 5mm rod will work on a prism kite or an ntk or sky dogs. A 2mm standoff clip can be replaced with a jaco. It's crazy to think that parts for kites all made in China need parts sent from the US around the world. or even across the country. If any one utters the phrase " what tricks will it do " without being prepared to repair thier kite, is  a fool or lives within spitting distance of a kite shop. There are few bad eggs in the business but they rarely last. Most of us are small operations and emails can get defered  and even mishandled. We could all read the after  one of our breaks here in the land where 6 weeks off a year is not the morm the shop owner was all over the issue. The public forum of outrage should at least be the course of action after a week of apemts not 48 hours.
Rob
« Last Edit: May 31, 2011, 02:23 PM by rncembal » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2011, 01:54 PM »

After reading in another thread about customer service I think it fair to say most kites don't use the above. It is correct that a kite new in the package should come complete and intact. You faithful readers and endusers should know that fixes are closer and easier than you think . An HQ part for a 5mm rod will work on a prism kite or an ntk or sky dogs. A 2mm standoff clip can be replaced with a jaco. It's crazy to think that parts for kites all made in China need parts sent from the US around the world. or even across the country. If any one utters the phrase " what tricks will it do " without being prepared to repair thier kite is  a fool or lives within spitting distance or a kite shop. There are few bad eggs in the business but they rarely last. Most of us are small operations and emails can get defered  and even mishandled. We could all read the after  one of our breaks here in the land where 6 weeks off a year is not the morm the shop owner was all over the issue. The public forum of outrage should at least be the course of action after a week of apemts not 48 hours.
Rob

Hear, hear !

And shame on the OP.

-Frazer
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zippy8
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« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2011, 07:35 AM »

  • When I buy any product I expect it to be undamaged and in perfect order.
  • When I e-mail a business I expect a reply within one working day. In my line of work, within the hour.

I don't think these are unreasonable expectations.

You might explain part of the delay as it was Memorial Weekend but that doesn't really come to mind to someone outside the USA in the same way that Bank Holiday Monday or Helätorstai won't mean anything to anyone inside the USA.

Dromel was a bit quick off the line but no more than that IMHO.

YMMV

Mike.
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Jeepster
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« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2011, 08:37 AM »

... When I e-mail a business I expect a reply within one working day. In my line of work, within the hour.[/li][/list] ...

Dromel was a bit quick off the line but no more than that IMHO. ...

Just to refresh our memory, John C. posted these times:

AWOC received these emails (all local times)

1st complaint:  Friday Night 10:30 PM (store closed)
2nd complaint: Saturday Night 11:30 PM (store closed)
3rd complaint sent to Daelyn: Monday (Memorial Day store closed)
..........................................................................................

Their store hours are 10 ~ 5 Monday thru Friday ... not stated, but it's realistically assumed they'd be closed for major holidays.

Dromel posted at 10:06am (local Las Vegas time) that he'd received an e-mail from AWOC.  Given a delay in reading the e-mail and posting here, that looks like AWOC answered his complaints before they opened for business. 

Since all of his e-mails were sent when the store was closed, and yet, answered right before it opened.  That probably should be classified as exception service.

In this day of international business one has to be aware of the time zones, holidays, business hours, etc. of their suppliers.  I would suggest that Dromel did not do his homework and was more than a bit quick off the line.  I would have expected a "sorry mate" ...

Regards,
Tom
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chilese
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« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2011, 10:57 AM »

Dromel and I have exchanged several emails.

Although we don't agree on everything, he did bring up some valid reasoning for most of his actions.

We have shaken virtual hands and at least brought to light an interesting aspect of international sales.

If buyers can expect kites in perfect condition, that should also mean that the retailer should expect perfect kites from the manufacturer.

How does one make the Flying Wing / New Tech types raise their QC to the point of perfection Mr. Zippy8?
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zippy8
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« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2011, 11:18 AM »

How does one make the Flying Wing / New Tech types raise their QC to the point of perfection Mr. Zippy8?
In the words on one of modern times' more enlightening philosophers*.... we don't expect perfection, just a damn sight less imperfection.

Mistakes happen, how they are dealt with often what makes the greater impression. In this case there is an explanation but what reaction do we expect when we open the new shiny, find it less than hoped for and aren't getting immediate satisfaction ? As I said, I think Dromel was a bit hasty but that's about the extent of the "crime". The shop's follow up seems excellent though so the real blame lies with the people who set the date for this holiday - the US government, amirite ?  Roll Eyes

And finally; the customer is always what Wink

Mike.
* Andy Capp
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Flying Fish
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« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2011, 11:43 AM »

I don't mean to open the whole case again, but there is one crucial element that no one is as yet aware of (except for John, whom I told via PM). The terms & conditions of the sale stipulate that any damage must be reported to AWOC within 5 days of receipt of the kite. Please note: the t&c do not state 5 business days. I reported the damage immediately upon receipt of the kite, early Friday morning UK time. I sent two more e-mails over the next 3 days (sent about a day earlier than reported above), so on Tuesday morning I had less than 1 of these 5 days left to get a reply from AWOC, or I would lose my right to any refund or sending of replacement parts. Because the t&c stipulate 'days' rather than 'business days', my assumption was that AWOC does not have 'business days' as such. As to doing my homework, I was aware of the memorial day in the US. I did not receive an automated e-mail from AWOC saying that they were closed because of this and would re-open then and then. I checked their web-site, and did not see any message about being closed there either. That fits the 'no specific business days' picture given of their business model from the t&c. My post was a last-ditch attempt to get any kind of reaction, with less than 24 hours left of the 'within 5 days' period.
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Jeepster
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« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2011, 12:26 PM »

... The terms & conditions of the sale stipulate that any damage must be reported to AWOC within 5 days of receipt of the kite. ...

Seems like that was accomplished Friday night ...
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Gamelord
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« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2011, 12:39 PM »

The standoff clips on the Silver Fox kites has been an issue for a while now.  I do agree that we should have stated Business Days on our T&C page.  That will be clarified better very soon.  Either way, I did get in touch with Dromel and his parts should be arriving within the next few days to fix his Silver Fox so he can fly it.

I highly agree with the statement and feelings that if a brand new product is purchased, it should arrive in perfect condition.  For this I am very sorry as I too would be much more frustrated and annoyed than Dromel has been with me.  In fact, he has been an exceptional customer and very understanding giving the circumstances that he ordered and paid for a kite that he has not yet been able to fly.  I would expect no less myself.

I did take it personally when the "warning to not do business with us" was posted because of our (assumed) poor customer "service" or the lack of.  I do take these things personally because that is the one thing that I have always striven for is to provide the best customer support and service in the industry.  Our store also has an entire section dedicated to kite replacement parts and replacement rods just so we can help keep kites up in the air where they belong, instead of stuffed away in a bag somewhere waiting weeks for a part to arrive from the manufacturer.

Regardless, we have (hopefully) rectified the situation, the replacement parts (plus spares) are on their way and hopefully Dromel will be able to enjoy the kite he has purchased.  It is only unfortunate that he is located on the other side of the pond and communication is much more difficult than if he was more locally available in the states.

I do agree with Rob that many of the parts on kites are interchangeable and any normal kite shop should have the pieces available to get the kite back in the air, even if the pieces don't have the actual factory label on them.  Prism, Premier, Skyburner, Skydog, New Tech, and pretty much every other kite manufacturer all use APA fittings.  None of them actually make these APA fittings themselves but purchase them already made. The difference here is that Dromel purchased a brand new kite that had an issue.  He should not be required to go out and also purchase some more replacement parts for a kite that he has not even had the chance to fly.  Being that he is a couple thousand miles away, it would probably been faster to just go to the local shop and get some new clips but it is our responsibility as a retailer to make sure the he is taken care of which is why I had no issues at all about sending him the parts from here - and at our cost including the international shipping charges.

Anyways, I hope things have been worked out and the issue taken care of.  I don't have a problem with it and I am glad that we were able to come to a solution that works for everyone involved.

I hope the next time we get a post from you Dromel, it is saying how much you enjoy the Vented Silver Fox.  It really is a great kite to fly and (IMO) one of the best looking vented kites made.
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Flying Fish
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« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2011, 12:57 PM »

Kent, the statement on poor service came out of desperation (given the situation I regarded myself in as described above, less than 24 hours left), and if I could retract it now, I would. I have not dealt with you before, so had no experience with you personally. Now that I do I regret making those particular comments. If John can remove those particular comments from my post in the other thread, I've got no problem with that, so they don't stand there after the issue has been resolved.

The next time I will post on this issue will be with a photo of the Silver Fox flying in the UK air. And as luck will have it, we will surely see the strong winds that have been a feature of kiting on the south coast for quite a while now die down to SUL level .....
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Stardragon
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« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2011, 09:14 PM »

Hasn't this dead horse been beaten enough times?
 
Molehill -----> Mountain -----> Anthill -----> Molehill

The main parties involved seem happier with the resolution than everyone else.

Ron
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Flying Fish
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« Reply #11 on: June 11, 2011, 06:34 AM »

As promised, my Silver Fox in the UK air; looks really good, very sharp!



Of course, as I predicted, the winds had died down to UL levels, but stubbornly, I tried the kite anyway. It flew just enough for an axel before coming down again, but it did taste UK air! Look forward to flying it when it's more in its element.
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