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Author Topic: Help !! Obi, John W.,RandyG,RobB... Please analyze this video..  (Read 2893 times)
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mikenchico
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« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2011, 12:05 PM »

Got me there Norm, yep starts from the fade ... no wonder I can't do them  Embarrassed
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RonG
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« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2011, 12:59 PM »

Since it's a continuous trick, you can start it from any position, just be sure to alternate directions.

Yeah.

Makes no difference at all which position in the trick you start at.

Because there are so many kite positions involved in the JL, it's a handy trick to string together with other stuff.
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Shane
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« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2011, 02:00 PM »

The easiest starting I have found is from a Fractured Axel to Fade... because it already has the proper motion going...
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« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2011, 05:19 PM »

Doing the JL blindfolded is kite dependent... I can do them all day long on the Sea Devils, but other kites are a struggle to get even 3 rungs. And then to get the proper R-L-R-L rotations  Roll Eyes  It's a rare day when my mind is that clear !   Cheesy
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tpatter
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« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2011, 05:47 PM »

Half axel to fade entry for my $.  Looks super clean.....  Smiley
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« Reply #20 on: August 25, 2011, 07:22 PM »

I don't care what anyone says U guys are the greatest...  I have been working from the fade.  I have practiced holding the fade longer.  I watched some great video's also.  Norm has helped a lot.  I saw Rob's video today also.  I through my arms out from my waist.  I saw Rob bring his hands in on his side.  I bring them in close together. I tried to work it tonight but wind was almost zero.  I had to fly Ocious sul..sucked.  Those video's that Norm posted are Really nice.  I appreciate all the help guys please keep it up.   I want to achieve a couple things.  Norm showed me some hand movements and suddenly I am doing multi-lazie's.. ( the little creep-o before he abandoned his friends showed me how to snap it before I pop it into a turtle. Norm showed me the hand movement.  I was pulling across my body...ALL SUMMER IT WAS A BUMMER>>>  Popped four in a row yesterday. 

I am on my way to learning Jacob's ladder.. Also I am going into a fade roll over and going for a roll up.  Had a few wraps and not afraid to learn anymore.  They really look cool.. Huh.  So the goal is four fold.. Turtle...Lazy Susan, Multi-Lazies,roll up then put them together...

It's August 25th.... Have to have them by mid-September...We did the 540 in a week... You guys have made me better keep it up...


HuhHuh   Do weights in tail make a difference???  Also I have decided to try different kites .  Also I need to spend time on shorter lines...  Foot work ?? entry's any thing else anyone can think of. 

Between the article's Rob posted and the Video's Norm just posted.  A ton of Great info for beginner or pro... Thanks guys.
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« Reply #21 on: August 25, 2011, 07:52 PM »

Hey Joe. Stuffs been crazy busy sofar here so I haven't gotten a chance to email you yet, sorry.

Been keeping up with your posts. Not once, all summer, even when you were beginning to understand them, did you ever pull across your body on wednesdays? Not sure where that came from but as you figured it out, it's not necessary.

Tail weight or no tail weight, just do it on the kite you're comfortable. For you try the WMs or the Solus' (assuming you have them?) and just start experimenting. Don't think just do. Every time we say that it seems to click for you but during the week, goes away (as we've talked about) and then comes back.  The more you begin to over analyze something the harder it becomes (from my experience). It's literally just a rotation-based turtle (multilazy). Think of it in super simple terms. Just when you get that nose down in a turtle, snap it around and continue beginning to feel where that 2nd pull is- if it's to late or to early the rotation goes haywire or the kite falls out of it. Beginning to realize the difference between a clean one and what is just listed won't be that hard but feeling it out for a bit will be. This is another thing that I've always thought about- tutorials sometimes slow the kite down during the trick. Well, that isn't going to happen when you're flying. So why bother trying to over analyze/identify that that specific moment, especially in slow motion? Just feel it out and see where it takes you. Trial and error has been extremely educational in my 15 (holy crap...) years of flying and I've learned what TO do during something, but a ton on what NOT to do, which is a lot more effective (for me) when learning other tricks too. While it's a pain in the beginning (heck, what sport/hobby isn't?) it'll pay off in the long run.

Happy tricking, and I'll try to get in touch with you soon. CCPA threw a concerto on us for our auditions not to long ago so I've been working up the Gordon Jacob Concerto and doing some mock auditions. I'll get in touch asap.

LittleCreep-o Tongue
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JimB
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« Reply #22 on: August 25, 2011, 08:50 PM »

From the TP USA Trick Definitions .pdf:


Jacob’s Ladder  [Ours des Prairies] Group 4, Video Footage: A, B, C, D, E
The JACOB’S LADDER is a continuous series of transitions between a half BACKSPIN rotation and a half LAZY
SUSAN. Each “rung” of the ladder consists of one set of the two alternating rotations. The direction of the
rotations does not matter. The trick is entered from either a FADE or a TURTLE. If it is entered from a FADE (belly
up, nose toward the pilot), the kite is rotated approximately 180° so that it is belly up, nose away as in a TURTLE,
but with the lines still over the leading edges and coming from under the kite. The kite is then rolled on the pitch
axis so that the nose swings down and around a full 360°, into a true TURTLE. The kite is then rotated
approximately 180°, so that it is belly up, nose toward the pilot as in a FADE, but with the lines still over the
trailing edge and coming from underneath. Finally the kite is rolled again on the pitch axis so that the nose
swings up and around a full 360°, into a true FADE. This entire sequence constitutes one full rung of JACOB’S
LADDER. (If the trick is entered from a TURTLE, it starts with a half LAZY SUSAN and the alternating sequence
continues as just described.) The kite must complete three full rungs of the ladder. The smoothness of the
transitions between positions is crucial to the quality of the trick. The method and direction of entry and exit do
not matter.
KEY ELEMENTS: ►Minimum 3 full rungs.



Since it's a continuous trick, you can start it from any position, just be sure to alternate directions.


Yeah.

Makes no difference at all which position in the trick you start at.

Because there are so many kite positions involved in the JL, it's a handy trick to string together with other stuff.

Only making reference to the instructions  HERE


« Last Edit: August 25, 2011, 08:56 PM by JimB » Logged
RonG
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« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2011, 02:43 AM »

From the TP USA Trick Definitions .pdf:


Jacob’s Ladder  [Ours des Prairies] Group 4, Video Footage: A, B, C, D, E
The JACOB’S LADDER is a continuous series of transitions between a half BACKSPIN rotation and a half LAZY
SUSAN. Each “rung” of the ladder consists of one set of the two alternating rotations. The direction of the
rotations does not matter. The trick is entered from either a FADE or a TURTLE. If it is entered from a FADE (belly
up, nose toward the pilot), the kite is rotated approximately 180° so that it is belly up, nose away as in a TURTLE,
but with the lines still over the leading edges and coming from under the kite. The kite is then rolled on the pitch
axis so that the nose swings down and around a full 360°, into a true TURTLE. The kite is then rotated
approximately 180°, so that it is belly up, nose toward the pilot as in a FADE, but with the lines still over the
trailing edge and coming from underneath. Finally the kite is rolled again on the pitch axis so that the nose
swings up and around a full 360°, into a true FADE. This entire sequence constitutes one full rung of JACOB’S
LADDER. (If the trick is entered from a TURTLE, it starts with a half LAZY SUSAN and the alternating sequence
continues as just described.) The kite must complete three full rungs of the ladder. The smoothness of the
transitions between positions is crucial to the quality of the trick. The method and direction of entry and exit do
not matter.
KEY ELEMENTS: ►Minimum 3 full rungs.

You mods are such rules wonks.  Those TP-USA guys must have had a real stick up their arse to get so technical about this stuff.

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Hadge
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« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2011, 03:48 AM »

Lets be honest, unless you're flying competitions, does it really matter which way you start it if you are flying for your own pleasure? I enter Jl's from the fade and the turtle.

Vert - I don't know if it will help you, but when I was learning JL's I split it down into 2 moves  Fade- Lateral roll - turtle  and then turtle - half lazy - back to fade. I practised each of these parts and then once I could do both parts , linked them together.  I found it easier than trying to get the whole thing in one move.

I also found Martin Madsen's (mama74) video very helpful.

Jacobs Ladder Tutorial
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JimB
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« Reply #25 on: August 26, 2011, 03:51 AM »

No it doesn't.

The guy credited with inventing the move (Tim Benson) probably goes from a fractured axel or pancake and does Six rungs for a full JL.

Hmm.. ABW probably has a description on his site somewhere.

Later.
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