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Author Topic: What is the wind speed for a vented kite.  (Read 4485 times)
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Wayner
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« on: August 28, 2011, 02:09 PM »

I'm getting back into sports kites.
What is a real usable range for a vented kite? Yes, I know not all vented kites are the same.
While a kites upper wind range may be 20 mph its not the same as usable wind.

I will be looking for a vented kite in the near future.
 
My UL is a Shadow and looking to add an UL WM
My STD are Infinity & JJF and I love them both.
I have a SF 2.5 Vented. Got it for its looks but its performance is only OK. Plus it pulls hard for a vented kite. 

Wayne
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Hadge
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« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2011, 02:59 PM »

It varies a bit on different kites. Trickable range probably 8-10mph to around 18mph, upper limit maybe mid 20's but by then you are just painting the sky.  The SF is a big kite and even vented will have a good pull.  I also have a Shadow and Infinity but for a vented I use a modified HQ Jive, which being a smaller kite has noticably less pull.

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Allen Carter
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« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2011, 04:01 PM »

The Silver Fox 2.5 is a good vented kite, but a kite that big will pull hard even with quite a bit of venting.

If your goal for a high wind kite is primarily reduced pull, then a smaller kite would be the way to go. A lot of the best high wind kites I've flown still pull just fine but are slower and easier to stall than a standard version in the same wind. When you put enough screen in a kite to make it pull like you're flying in 5mph, the kite is almost always a poor performer.
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Allen, AKA kitehead
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« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2011, 05:03 PM »

Pull is the primary factor for me - you can't trick or even do decent precision when the kite is literally yanking you around the field.  Plus, I want to be able to fly for a few hours and still be able to feel my arms, wrists, and fingers.

My favorite high wind kite is the transformer mid vent.  I fly it in 20 mph using the 2 finger straps that Steve makes and sells here on the forum and have a ball.  Amazing precision and tricks in both standard and high wind.
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« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2011, 12:14 AM »

Depends on the kite and how much running you do.

In high wind I keep tricking but I'm spending a lot more time running and tricking out of the center of the window / hanging nearer the edge of the window. I also change many of the tricks I do. Like Tom, I've been flying the Transformer Vent. It has small vents but it's smaller overall with a light pull so it tricks well in high wind. But high wind tricking is still a good workout. Kites with lots of venting tend to lose drive quickly as opposed to tapering down as the wind drops.
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Bob D
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« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2011, 08:18 AM »

Anything in the teens is going to have too much pull for me. I have trouble making the inputs work for me when the kite is pulling so hard.

In the low teens, I like to use the partial vents in my Nirvana or Transfer and it will trick pretty well.

Anything more than the low teens and I get out the Revs.
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Bob D.
Wayner
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« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2011, 11:41 AM »

Thanks all for the feedback.
I was glad to see I was not alone on the issue of pull in tricking. I'm use to lots of pull with my TOTL kites but they don't trick  Embarrassed

I can see the value in a smaller kite. While I prefer a large kite, I love my JJF and this has performed well (in my rookie hands) off the center of the window. At this time I have better success with the JJF than my SF vent.

Dolphinboy, you pointed out the issue that high vented kites losing their drive quickly when the wind drops. This drives me crazy with the SF vented. I can see a mid vent being a good choice for a future kite.

One last question on wind screens.
My T&T competition came with screens and they work well. This is an old school kite. Would wind screens be of value on my JJF?
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Bob D
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« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2011, 03:54 AM »

Winds screens will help with ANY kite! There's no substitute for lighter wind though.
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Bob D.
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« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2011, 08:44 AM »

also keep in mind that yes you can pop wind screens (of any sort) onto the kite/lines to slow it down...but will the frame actually withstand that much wind?HuhHuh??

i loved flying a Micron with a 2" wind tamer in 25mph....
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RonG
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« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2011, 11:49 AM »

My T&T competition came with screens and they work well. This is an old school kite. Would wind screens be of value on my JJF?

Maybe.  Screens can slow things down significantly, but they can change the behavior of the kite a lot, particularly when you depart from straight-line flying and start considering the rotation and pitch involved in tricks.

Vents also change the behavior of a kite of course, but at least with those the designer can experiment and find distributions and placements that do the least harm.  My preference, both with my own kite and others, is the less venting the better.  Vent just enough to take the "edge" off, but don't try to make it feel like an ultralight.

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RobB
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« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2011, 12:44 PM »

I find that most vented kites have a dead feel to them, and fly so much differently that they're not much fun. The Nebula vent and Fearless VL fly like normal kites, but they're only good up until 15mph, then they become too much to keep up with, too.
That's why I got a 1.5b full vent, for those 15+mph days...

~Rob.
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Doug S
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« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2011, 06:50 PM »

Years ago (mid-late 1990s) I made a few kites where you could cover part or all of the various vents so that you could dial the kite in for the wind speed.  The covers slipped into a pocket around each vent and snapped into place.  Takes a bit of labor to make the low profile pockets and covers so that they are aerodynamically clean.  The kites were framed with an old Skyshark bullet proof wrapped tapper frame and a prototype hybrid center spine made by Erez.  The kites had the same low end as a standard.  Worked well for my needs.  I donít know if anyone is doing this anymore.
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RonG
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« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2011, 07:53 PM »

Years ago (mid-late 1990s) I made a few kites where you could cover part or all of the various vents so that you could dial the kite in for the wind speed.  The covers slipped into a pocket around each vent and snapped into place.  Takes a bit of labor to make the low profile pockets and covers so that they are aerodynamically clean.  The kites were framed with an old Skyshark bullet proof wrapped tapper frame and a prototype hybrid center spine made by Erez.  The kites had the same low end as a standard.  Worked well for my needs.  I donít know if anyone is doing this anymore.

The concept of variable venting has been used on a number of kites since then.  Some vented kites (like mine) use removable patches that velcro onto the sail.  A few have gotten a little more refined, with pockets that can have covers slipped into them.  The idea in all cases was to allow for pilot preference, and venting the kite just enough for the current conditions.

Of course there have been a few "dynamic" venting systems along the way too.  The Aerodrone Speed Limit was the first that I know of, but there have been a few others since.
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Wayner
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« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2011, 09:37 PM »

Very informative.

I am looking into a variable vent kite.

I have the material to make my own screens as my T&T screen will not fit my current kites.
 
The Nebula vent looks very interesting, same thy don't make them anymore. I will think on Hadge idea of adding vents to and existing kite. Would be interesting to see how it would fly with a lot of small holes. Huh

Thanks for all your help
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Bob D
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« Reply #14 on: August 31, 2011, 04:26 AM »

I like the variable vents that the Transfer and Nirvana has. (I had a little trouble figuring out how the Nirvana's pocket worked to slide the panel in. Nice system though.) I agree with Ron. I only use as much venting as needed to take the edge off. Too much and it stops tricking like a standard. I flew a Level One Vented Easy once and all those holes made it harder to trick.
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Bob D.
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