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Author Topic: Vortex, my first kite build!  (Read 17118 times)
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Will Sturdy
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« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2011, 04:41 AM »

Looks like you're on the right track - just watch out for the bubbles in the seams Smiley Looks like something funky might be going on towards the upper spine, but it looks small enough that it's probably not going to cause any trouble.

For what it's worth, I've found walking feet more pain than they are worth. If everything's taped, they don't do any good and there's lots that can go wrong. They're all around finicky.
On the other hand I've had very positive experiences with integrated walking feet. Just helps everything move a bit more smoothly. These are only found on industrial machines though - the pfaffs are only a close approximation. The IDT, although not truly a dual feed, does help some.
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AKA_MrBill
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« Reply #16 on: November 07, 2011, 08:41 AM »

As mentioned previously, I will be using my BMK Exile as a source of inspiration and information for this build.
I needed to know the approximate pitch to sew each of the stitches I will be using. So, based on the following images, I can say 3mm is fairly consistent.




Additionally, as seen in the first image, Ken appears to build his TE's with Slit RSN. In the stand off area , he re-enforces it with Mylar cloth and a small section of Dacron. Hmmm, sounds just like what Paolo posted.  Wink

OK, time to start sewing!!
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nobbl2k
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« Reply #17 on: November 07, 2011, 11:41 AM »

Where is the eye candy?Huh  Sad
You just forgot it!!!!  Cry
 Smiley
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AKA_MrBill
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« Reply #18 on: November 07, 2011, 11:46 AM »

Where is the eye candy?Huh  Sad
You just forgot it!!!!  :'(
 Smiley


Sorry Nobbl2k, I was excited about getting started this morning, so, yes, I didn't post one. But, since it pleases you so much, here is one just for you!! Cheesy

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nobbl2k
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« Reply #19 on: November 07, 2011, 11:53 AM »

Wow! Beautiful one! Thanks a lot! Smiley
BTW: I have a Vortex std and UL, both sails sewn by Christian Derefat.
I like them both very much! Great kites!
I hope you have as much fun flying them as you have building them.
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AKA_MrBill
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« Reply #20 on: November 07, 2011, 12:24 PM »

When I first started thinking about building my own kite, I started reading a lot of different posts and tutorials. It must have been worth it, because I am VERY HAPPY with the results so far! I must admit, I was rather nervous about sewing the panels together because I am so new at this. I really wasn't expecting a great result, I was hoping though.
Armed with the knowledge I had gleaned, I dove in this morning head first. Thanks to the detailed documentation Sugarbaker had posted in his B'Zar 2011 build, I was able to sew both sails with great results. Here is a shot of part of the right sail.


You'll notice one seam with no stitching yet. That is because the Mylar cloth I ordered last week has not arrived yet.

One of the details Sugarbaker mentioned is to try to get the seams from one section to cross another. In doing this, you will help tie down the seam and help preventing it from coming loose. I was fortunate enough to be able to do this at every intersection! See below for an example.

I also used Sugarbakers technique of tying off the threads at the end of each seam. It works really well!

Now one thing many people pointed out was that using seam tape gummed up their needles. I am no exception. Keeping it clean was something that had to be done between almost every seam. I did find that using a Q-tip and some Isopropyl did clean it up very well. I need to find a way to prevent build up, or switch to using glue.  Sad


OK, for all you Eye Candy freaks......  This is a view of Yosemite Valley from the top of North Dome. Half Dome is at my back.
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madhabitz
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« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2011, 12:58 PM »

Looks like you're on the right track - just watch out for the bubbles in the seams Smiley Looks like something funky might be going on towards the upper spine, but it looks small enough that it's probably not going to cause any trouble.

For what it's worth, I've found walking feet more pain than they are worth. If everything's taped, they don't do any good and there's lots that can go wrong. They're all around finicky.
On the other hand I've had very positive experiences with integrated walking feet. Just helps everything move a bit more smoothly. These are only found on industrial machines though - the pfaffs are only a close approximation. The IDT, although not truly a dual feed, does help some.

Walking feet... some of them are finicky, but worth it when they do what they're supposed to do. It would be well worth investing in an industrial machine if you were going to be doing a lot of sewing and it became your fulltime hobby or something you are doing for an income, but otherwise... not so much.

I had a Pfaff for years and years and those dual feed dogs do exactly what they are supposed to do. There's nothing like 'em on any other machine and well worth the price whether you buy new or are lucky enough to find a used one in good working order at a great price.

Mr.B, I think you are doing a wonderful job of it-- it's been fun to watch you do this project.

Nancy
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Ca Ike
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« Reply #22 on: November 07, 2011, 03:36 PM »

THere was a tip someone posted a while back for helping keep the tape from gumming up the needle that works really well.  Take some velcro (the fuzzy side) and stick it near the thread guide before it goes into the little lever guide (the one that goes up n down to pull the tread from the spool).  Put some sewing oil or other light oil on the velcro, run the thread across it using the hook side to hold it down.  THe thread will pick up the oil letting it feed through the guides smoother and keep the tip of the needle lubed with just enough to coat the needle stopping the tape glue build up without leaving too much oil on the seam like you get from putting oil directly on the needle. 
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sugarbaker
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« Reply #23 on: November 07, 2011, 05:49 PM »

Your vortex and your build thread are coming along nicely!  I've not been working on any kites, or updating my threads much this week because I've been camping and hiking in the subject of many of your photos, Yosemite!  Your photos are great, and I know the effort you made to get to your viewpoints, as I have climbed the 4 mile trail and others.

Anyway, keep up the great work... If you are persistant, you may finish your thread before I finish mine!
« Last Edit: November 08, 2011, 09:02 PM by sugarbaker » Logged
AKA_MrBill
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« Reply #24 on: November 08, 2011, 08:35 AM »

So, here is this mornings issue and I am asking for your opinion on it.

In my haste to get everything ordered and delivered so I could build this kite during my two week surgery recovery time, I ordered 1" Dacron to use as the TE. As many have already pointed out, Dacron is not a good choice for this purpose. So, yesterday I ordered a 50 yard roll of 1", .75oz Slit RSL. It "should" be here this Thursday if I'm lucky.

In the mean time, the 2 yards of "Cinnamon" 1.5 oz. Diamond RSL I had ordered for making the Kite Bag out of has arrived. So, today I will be making the bag. This is the same cloth Sugarbaker has used in his thread, it is also the same cloth my BMK Exile's bag is made from. But I had a thought and would like your opinions on it. Would it be a good idea to cut strips of the Diamond RSL to use as TE cloth?

Here is a picture of the cloth laid on top of the sail so you can see how the colors play off each other. This cloth is almost iridescent. The tone shifts as the angle of view changes.

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mikenchico
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« Reply #25 on: November 08, 2011, 08:55 AM »

My opinion would be no. That cloth is a looser weave. I'm not familar with the one you have, whether it's coated or not, the ones I have are coated and impossible to hot cut and they do fray when cold cut. I would wait.

My preference is to use the 1.5 oz tape for more durability and i feel it lays flatter and doesn't pucker around the stitches, the weight difference is insignificant.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2011, 09:27 AM by mikenchico » Logged

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AKA_MrBill
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« Reply #26 on: November 08, 2011, 09:38 AM »

My opinion would be no. That cloth is a looser weave. I'm not familar with the one you have, whether it's coated or not, the ones I have are coated and impossible to hot cut and they do fray when cold cut. I would wait.

My preference is to use the 1.5 oz tape for more durability and i feel it lays flatter and doesn't pucker around the stitches, the weight difference is insignificant.
Quote
Would it be a good idea to cut strips of the Diamond RSL to use as TE cloth?

No, I wouldn't recommend it. The material used for bags is too stretchy, heavy and not durable enough for a trailing edge.


I thought that might be the general consensus.
I was able to hot cut two 6" wide strips for the Kite Bag. So, it is possible to cut, but I really needed to take my time.

BTW, this cloth is coated and water proof, but that also makes it rather stiff. So, I'll wait for the slit RSN. No problem, I have plenty to keep me occupied while I wait.   Wink. I'll have the bag finished in a couple hours, then back to working the nose and spine.

Eye Candy time!!!
This is an attempt at B&W conversion. This was captured in Kapa'a on Kauai.
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AKA_MrBill
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« Reply #27 on: November 08, 2011, 05:36 PM »

Let me start with a follow up to my last post about the kite bag. Let me just say, it looks awesome! Here is a shot of the opening end with the flap closed. I think you can see what I meant about this cloth being iridescent. And, yes, it does shimmer like that in real life.


OK, 'nough about the Kite sleeve.
Today I didn't spend nearly as much time on the kite as I did yesterday.  Grin

I added a nose ere-enforcement patch prety much exactly as Sugarbaker had described. Heck, when building a UL, you might as well use the lightest materials that will get the job done. So, PC31 it is. I happened to have a piece of scrap that fit perfectly. If/when I build another Vortex, the only difference I might make is to use a smaller, semi-circular piece that matches the nose webbing more accurately. You will see what I mean when I put the nose together later.

Here is what it looked like before I cleaned it up.


And after trimming it down. Yes, that's me waving to you in the background.  Tongue


I've become a real fan of hot cutting, but one thing is certain, the more time you spend preparing to cut, the better the results!
Here is an example of how I set up to trim off the overlap.


So, tomorrow I'll be setting up the spine re-enforcement.

Here is the last piece of Eye Candy for today. Can you guess where this was taken?

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coogee
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« Reply #28 on: November 09, 2011, 01:16 AM »

Cool Rock........err Hoover Dam
     Mike
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AKA_MrBill
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« Reply #29 on: November 09, 2011, 07:51 AM »

Cool Rock........err Hoover Dam
     Mike

Swing, and a miss. HINT, wrong state.

OK, a quick thought popped into my head this morning while I was inspecting the spars I will be using for the frame.

While fitting end caps on the P90 I will be using for the ULE, I got the feeling that the end looked a little fragile to be unsupported in the nose with just a Vinyl cap on it. So, would gluing a short section, say 1"-1.5", of .240 ferrule flush in the end of the spar be a good idea? I know it will add a tiny bit of weight, but the trade off for durability seems reasonable to me.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2011, 08:07 AM by AKA_MrBill » Logged
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