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Author Topic: Upside Down Line Setup  (Read 8156 times)
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lasapcheong
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« Reply #15 on: May 07, 2009, 05:51 PM »


There might be a correlation between tendency to fly inverted more and having heavy brakes on a Rev. With heavy brakes, upright hovers are actually pretty difficult especially if the wind isn't stiff enough. Inverted hovers are actually much easier. The heavier the brakes, the harder it is to maintian an upright hover, especially close to the ground if the wind isn't strong enough.

-Darryl
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"One day I'll learn to comete my quad and hover my dual-line for a minute anywhere in the window"
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moegeo
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« Reply #16 on: May 07, 2009, 05:54 PM »

Tell you what...I plan on going out tomorrow. I 'll switch the lines and report back. It will be tough to have to think again Wink
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lylenc
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« Reply #17 on: May 07, 2009, 06:28 PM »

If I went to the trouble of inverting the top and bottom lines to take out the twists in each pair, I'd also swap handles into the opposite hands so the pairs aren't crossed either.

I spend half the time with the leading edge vertical or the kite rotated a revolution, so nothing much would be gained. No matter what one does, one needs to find neutral for up/down and side/side then adjust the pigtails so the wrists are in a comfortable position.

I do like your "out of the box" thinking. That's how a "weird" idea becomes the next "why didn't I think of that" idea.

I liked the look of the holey venting concept with the smaller holes. My estimate of the hole area was 38% of the total sail. However, for the estimate of number of holes, I used to big of a hole. That could be said about several of my body orifices too.

If the "prototype" isn't flying well as a vented with 5500 holes, it may need slighlty larger holes or another couple thouand holes. My guess is that slighly larger holes would reduce drag (or whatever force) faster than adding more small holes, for the same amount of material removed.

If there is a race to see who is the most anal, I must be in medal contention and closing in on the gold.
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Craig     Walla Walla, WA     Just One More!
chilese
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« Reply #18 on: May 07, 2009, 06:51 PM »

I guess I wasn't clear or totally accurate.

With the Rev upside-down, all 4 lines would basically go straight ahead. You were correct, if I just did top/bottom switch, there would still be a side to side cross-over.

Thanks for the excellent clarification. That was my intention, but I didn't propose it correctly.

On the other note, yes, larger holes (1/4" - 3/8") would probably be in the right ballpark. Might even need less holes at those larger sizes.
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John Chilese: Las Vegas, NV
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Watty
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« Reply #19 on: May 07, 2009, 08:13 PM »

I am one that flies a LOT inverted... in fact, an inverted hover is the most comfortable place to sit for me. I think this is mostly because of my heavy breaks like lasapcheong mentioned. I have actually tried swapping the top and bottom lines on the handles just because I was kind of bored...... Frankly, it didn't end well. With my hands on the foam of the handles, It was difficult to get good leverage on the break lines to let it fly inverted. Plus, it felt strange O_o.

Also, there is really not a whole lot of friction going on between the lines when flying inverted to really worry about it. Most of the time, the lines don't even touch, and if they do, it is only slightly. If one is worried about wearing down one's lines, one might as well try spinning the handles while making the kite do a cartwheel.
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tonycarl60
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« Reply #20 on: May 07, 2009, 10:51 PM »

One time I put the wing of a r/c glider on upside down so I could fly the glider easier inverted. Smiley
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kitelover
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« Reply #21 on: May 08, 2009, 08:09 AM »

John,  If we made wheels square, we might not need parking brakes on cars. Hmm, just a thought. Or is it?
Seriously though, it took sooo many hours before that inverted/crossed lines thing became second nature, I'm really having a problem with your idea. Step away from the Rev. buddy.
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chilese
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« Reply #22 on: May 08, 2009, 09:37 AM »

Well then, we just start teaching new fliers with the upside down setup. They won't know it's not normal. And they will ultimately have the upside down hover without lines crossed experience.

BTW, kitelover, I don't fly Revs too often (maybe once a month). Just like to give the Rev fliers food for thought. Remember, the more lines attached to your kite, the more of an anal retentive control freak you are (and I say that with love  Kiss).
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John Chilese: Las Vegas, NV
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kiten00b
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« Reply #23 on: May 08, 2009, 09:44 AM »

if crossed lines is such an issue, why don't you fly with a control bar that you can twirl like a baton as your lines wrap?
as long as you're using modern kite lines and not string from the hardware store, a few twists in the line has a negligible  effect on flying
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indigo_wolf
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« Reply #24 on: May 08, 2009, 09:56 AM »

Remember, the more lines attached to your kite, the more of an anal retentive control freak you are (and I say that with love  Kiss).
Could we add the caveat that on a fixed bridle foil, the additional control lines are also a survival tool?  They're the "Whoa Ponies" lines.

ATB,
Sam
« Last Edit: May 08, 2009, 09:59 AM by indigo_wolf » Logged
Watty
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« Reply #25 on: May 08, 2009, 10:03 AM »

Well then, we just start teaching new fliers with the upside down setup. They won't know it's not normal. And they will ultimately have the upside down hover without lines crossed experience.

BTW, kitelover, I don't fly Revs too often (maybe once a month). Just like to give the Rev fliers food for thought. Remember, the more lines attached to your kite, the more of an anal retentive control freak you are (and I say that with love  Kiss).
Well, it isn't just the fact that it is out of our comfort zone. The switching of top and bottom lines causes the reverse to not have the precise control that it normally has. It seems to be more prone to being over-controlled. This is, if you are holding the handles correctly (hands on foam).
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Dano
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« Reply #26 on: May 08, 2009, 11:23 AM »

Remember, the more lines attached to your kite, the more of an anal retentive control freak you are.

You've just confirmed it, and i'm sticking with my original reply...

You're Funny!  Cheesy

Thanks John
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tonycarl60
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« Reply #27 on: May 08, 2009, 02:21 PM »

Buy a Benson Airbow, symmetrical kite and handles Smiley
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Watty
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« Reply #28 on: May 08, 2009, 05:33 PM »

I went out and played with this a bit more today. With this setup, when inverted there were no twists in the lines. I was able to hold a somewhat stable inverted hover. However, I noticed that there was a LOT of tension on what are usually the break lines. This made my hands get tired much faster than normal. I could not relax as much as normal.
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chilese
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« Reply #29 on: May 08, 2009, 06:04 PM »

Maybe the handles would have to be redesigned for the upside down "normal" orientation.

Did you try the long part of the handles on top, foam on bottom?

By the way, thanks for taking a look at this. I value your inputs.  Smiley
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John Chilese: Las Vegas, NV
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