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Author Topic: First Observations and flight on Zero G  (Read 2753 times)
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Kantaxel
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« on: May 06, 2012, 12:05 PM »

So.....
I got to finally fly the Zero this morning.  Of note is that our flight area is about a 50X45 fT. area in the front yard with lots of obstructions and winds that swirl coming from all 4  directions.

First off, the kite is certainly a glider.  Smooth and long glides were obtainable on the factory settings especially down wind.  In any wind at all the kite does not want to turn upwind with little to no elevation... It will just nose into the grass, and bringing the canard forward is a bit difficullt with the way it's bridled, into the wind.  I would suggest that one uses a heavier line, than is supplied with the kite, in any wind at all. It will definitely cut or burn you as you pay out under tension or stop the the pay out.   I flew it for awhile and then decided to mess with the bridle attach point and found it is a lot better low rather than high, for the wind conditions here that would go from 0 to 6 or seven MPH.

I then tried to adjust the nose tension and was very disappointed that, at least on our kite, the sliding fitting appears to be glued.  It is on the factory marks, that's one good thing, for sure, but our kite has no adjustment. Cry Cry

All in all, it is a totally different glider than anything else I've flown and the case and packaging are far superior to anything FW has to offer..........the assembly instructions and paperwork that come with are also excellent and so are the links to the Prism website and the videos Prism has provided.

I give Mark an A++ on this one

Jim
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Ca Ike
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« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2012, 04:48 PM »

I haven't flown mine yet JIm but I have played with the setup.  On mine the canards tension slider was really tight and took some work to get it to move but once I did it moves a bit easier.  IT helps to flex the spine and take tension off the lines for the first few tries and twist the fitting. if it feels like its glued try moving it before you assemble the kite.
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chilese
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« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2012, 05:58 PM »

Took some pics this afternoon in the backyard.

Had trouble in the past getting good close-ups of the kite in flight.

Solved the problem.  Smiley

Linked photos start below:
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John Chilese: Las Vegas, NV
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thief
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« Reply #3 on: May 06, 2012, 06:09 PM »

I give Mark an A++ on this one

Jim
Sorry....Mark might get a bit of credit but that A++ really goes to ceewan.........
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Ca Ike
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« Reply #4 on: May 06, 2012, 06:27 PM »

I give Mark an A++ on this one

Jim
Sorry....Mark might get a bit of credit but that A++ really goes to ceewan.........
I give Ceewan an A+ for the design and Mark the A+ for the innovative fittings and adjustments.  BOthe for the graphics.
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chilese
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« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2012, 07:03 PM »

You might want to give a little credit to the over 90 year old Platz glider.

Ceewan did.

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John Chilese: Las Vegas, NV
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Kantaxel
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« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2012, 09:31 PM »

I haven't flown mine yet JIm but I have played with the setup.  On mine the canards tension slider was really tight and took some work to get it to move but once I did it moves a bit easier.  IT helps to flex the spine and take tension off the lines for the first few tries and twist the fitting. if it feels like its glued try moving it before you assemble the kite.

Sorry, this one ain't moving Sad//  Took it totally apart, put both ends on a flat surface and twisted and tapped the fitting while holding on to the spar...........I actually think I see remnants of glue on the nose end of the fitting.........(towards the nose)  It's really no big deal, just a tad bit disappointing......

Jim
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Ca Ike
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« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2012, 02:33 AM »

Hmm that kinda sucks but the heat trick to break the glue bond will work but I wonder if they got mixed up on the rods.  Check and see if the fitting is the same distance as the wing fitting.  No matter though  you know as well as I do a quick call to prism will resolve it.  I flew mine for a bit tonight and that adjustment makes a big difference in how the kite handles.
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Kantaxel
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« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2012, 08:05 AM »

you know as well as I do a quick call to prism will resolve it.  I flew mine for a bit tonight and that adjustment makes a big difference in how the kite handles.

I think it would be better to wait a month or two, or until there is an excess of available kites..........this event is not really new to me......Had some problems with the 4D and the first run of Zephyrs.........I give Mark a break when it comes to new kites in production.......There is always a let's see how the factory is doing thing going on.

I just can't wait to get it in a more wide open area with no wind or at least a little coming from one consistent direction.......I can fool with the spine tension later Lips sealed 
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OldPilot
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« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2012, 10:47 PM »

I had great expectations after seeing the Zero-G in videos and at a festival, but so far have been disappointed with mine. I must point out, this is for indoor flying only. I can do a better job flying my Skate and far better with my modified Platz gliders, copies of the design by Dick Curran*.  I was quite impressed by the videos of Howard Bashant's* and Wayne Dowler's flying*. I suspect that my problem is in the adjustments. I have contacted both to ask for recommended adjustments. Wayne just said to experiment until you get what you like, and I haven't heard from Howard yet.

* - Google any of these for YouTube videros.

The nose tension fitting CAN be moved. Heat may help; careful persistence worked for me. The knot on the short cord connecting the canards trailing edge to the spine can be moved also. The fact that the forward end of the bridle connects to this line, sliding on the spine rod rather than tied to it, is a unique feature of the kite. This creates an active control of the canard incidence, making it dependent upon the tension (pull) on the bridle. Changing the nose tension adjustment does not change the glider geometry, but changes the resistance of the canards to respond to the bridle pull. Reducing the nose line tension , by moving the fitting on the spine foward, should allow the canards to respond more to pull on the bridle. Changes to the length of the line connecting the canard trailing edge to the bridle and spine (by sliding the knot) should affect both the glide and the response to bridle pull. The location of the tow point on the bridle will affect only the climb and turning under pull. So, you can see that there are interelated adjustments and many combinations possible. I haven't found a satisfactory combination yet, and wouild appreciate any recommendations for good performance.


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Ca Ike
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« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2012, 12:31 AM »

I had great expectations after seeing the Zero-G in videos and at a festival, but so far have been disappointed with mine. I must point out, this is for indoor flying only. I can do a better job flying my Skate and far better with my modified Platz gliders, copies of the design by Dick Curran*.  I was quite impressed by the videos of Howard Bashant's* and Wayne Dowler's flying*. I suspect that my problem is in the adjustments. I have contacted both to ask for recommended adjustments. Wayne just said to experiment until you get what you like, and I haven't heard from Howard yet.

* - Google any of these for YouTube videros.

The nose tension fitting CAN be moved. Heat may help; careful persistence worked for me. The knot on the short cord connecting the canards trailing edge to the spine can be moved also. The fact that the forward end of the bridle connects to this line, sliding on the spine rod rather than tied to it, is a unique feature of the kite. This creates an active control of the canard incidence, making it dependent upon the tension (pull) on the bridle. Changing the nose tension adjustment does not change the glider geometry, but changes the resistance of the canards to respond to the bridle pull. Reducing the nose line tension , by moving the fitting on the spine foward, should allow the canards to respond more to pull on the bridle. Changes to the length of the line connecting the canard trailing edge to the bridle and spine (by sliding the knot) should affect both the glide and the response to bridle pull. The location of the tow point on the bridle will affect only the climb and turning under pull. So, you can see that there are interelated adjustments and many combinations possible. I haven't found a satisfactory combination yet, and wouild appreciate any recommendations for good performance.



Ok first off your misunderstanding how the nose adjustment affects the kite so that may be partly why you haven't found a good set up.  The nose adjustment changes the bow of the spine which changes the angle of incidence of the rear wing making the kite nose up faster or slower depending on how you set it.  It also changes the sweep angle of the canard wings some making for a bit faster speed(some affect on turn rate as well).  The line on the canard to spine only adjusts the slack angle of the canards affecting glide stability.  This latter adjustment I found should only be used If really needed to fine tune the glide path by lengthening or shortening the line to get the kite to glide true and not rock side to side. 

Now for indoor or dead calm out door going for long glides I leave the nose setting stock and set the bridle in the middle or forward.  IF the kite glides nose down shorten the center canard line some so the kite glides just slightly nose high but doesn't nose up.  IF it still noses down a bit in a glide and you have gone as short as you can on the center canard line then move the nose slider 1/16 inch toward the rear wing.  1/16 on the nose slider does a lot.  Once you get it set so it glides long, flat and lands on the center T at the end of a glide, mark it and that should be your starting point for future flights.  Fast active flight will be 1/8 to 1/2 inch from your base  tune point depending on how active you want it.

Keep in mind that variations during building at the factory as well as the flex variations from rod to rod in a particular batch will really affect the base tuning so no two kites will have the same base set up.  My two zero g's base settings are nearly 1/8 inch apart and they are from the same build run.  One spine happens to flex easier than the other.
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WestAustralian
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« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2013, 07:12 PM »

The Zero-G is a Sweet kite.

I also Fly the Wala and Wala XL.

The Zero-G glides easier and Longer for me than the Wala family.
It does become less control-able in mild winds though, it starts to fly like a regular kite rather than a glider.

The Zero-G is for those really light to Zero wind days.

Top Marks to all those involved in it's creation.

WA
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portlandflyer
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« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2013, 11:41 AM »

I had not thought of how each rod might have a slightly different bend to it!! I missed the canard to bridle adjustment, but the kite was a friends, and I had some limited time on it!! On his, we had to move the nose adjustment towards the nose! We also moved the towpoint to the rear for a quicker response! Loosening up the canards seemed to help the glide for us and helped it climb faster! But as was said, every kite might be assembled a little differently, hence our adjustments differ from others!! That's the beauty of these, experimenting to find what works for you! Knowing what did what, marking "happy places" for the future, all add up to the fun!!
I have to say - my older Plutz II keeps it simple with only the towpoint to adjust!! But now I'm looking forward to getting one of CeeWan's Mega-Plutzs and the surprises that brings!!
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