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Author Topic: SUL KITE cascade  (Read 1631 times)
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ko
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« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2012, 04:42 PM »

+1 with Will The only difference I find with the Tattoo (pretty much a fearless sul) is it is way easy to rotate too far making it tough to get it headed back. otherwise It does them gracefully and easily slow and flat I gave up on one pop cascades early on.(thanx Marco)
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have fun kurt
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« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2012, 06:52 PM »

Will S
If You starting from left to right then It should be ( I gess) :
 L R R L L R R L L R
BOLD in text pop
UNBOLD in text pull

Damn! There's hope for me yet! I've been a jazz drummer for 50 years. If we can code all these kite "tricks" as rudiments, I might be able to handle it! This one's in 5/4 with unusual accents and sticking, but I can at least understand it! Tongue

Ken
Well, this is coming from someone who hasn't done a cascade yet, but thinks he has the gist...no, it's not 5/4. It's normal ol' 4/4, with accents evenly spaced. Call the first pop a pickup note, and the repeating pattern becomes very clear. Two hits with each hand (well, a pull then a hard pop, as described earlier), the second being stronger. Of course, that's assuming even spacing, which might not be the case. Probably depends on the kite, the wind, etc. All the usual variables.

Now I just need to find some time (and smooth wind) to go try it.
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vigli
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« Reply #17 on: July 16, 2012, 07:22 AM »

thanks friends
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Ken Bour
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« Reply #18 on: July 19, 2012, 09:59 AM »

Will S
If You starting from left to right then It should be ( I gess) :
 L R R L L R R L L R
BOLD in text pop
UNBOLD in text pull

Damn! There's hope for me yet! I've been a jazz drummer for 50 years. If we can code all these kite "tricks" as rudiments, I might be able to handle it! This one's in 5/4 with unusual accents and sticking, but I can at least understand it! Tongue

Ken
Well, this is coming from someone who hasn't done a cascade yet, but thinks he has the gist...no, it's not 5/4. It's normal ol' 4/4, with accents evenly spaced. Call the first pop a pickup note, and the repeating pattern becomes very clear. Two hits with each hand (well, a pull then a hard pop, as described earlier), the second being stronger. Of course, that's assuming even spacing, which might not be the case. Probably depends on the kite, the wind, etc. All the usual variables.

Now I just need to find some time (and smooth wind) to go try it.

I see, it's a double-stroke roll (R R L L) preceded by a pop to get the kite rotating?

I am intrigued by the possibility of developing something similar to what guitarists call a tablature. It could have a couple of lines, one for Right and one for Left plus, maybe, a kite orientation (O). Using some conventions for <push>, <tug>, <pop>, <pull>, <snap>, <stall>, (others?), it might be possible to codify the movements crisply for every trick in the book - even simultaneous hand movements. Thinking about the above Cascade example and using the terminology already provided (not that I'm advocating it), here's what I am envisioning as a thought-provoker:

Trick: Cascade (Cd)
O: Fly L > R
R: |-----|--P--T--|--------|--P--T--|--------|--P--|
L: |--T--|--------|--P--T--|--------|--P--T--|-----|

Legend:
P = pull
T = tug or pop (equivalent?)

I grant that lotsa work would be needed to flesh out the "standard" movements (pop vs. tug vs. pull) and also whether there should be modifiers (similar to accents in music) like "gentle push," "sharp tug," and the like. Perhaps other directions need to be incorporated such as what key/time signatures do in music. Still, it seems theoretically achievable and, if it could be done, imaging having plastic-coated index cards with each trick, which could be organized into a deck. The cards could be shuffled to produce routines or patterns ... oh, the possibilities! Huh

If this idea has merit, I would be happy to start another thread and we can explore it. If it's already been done (probably), maybe someone can provide a link. I'm prepared that someone will claim it is impossible (due to varying wind conditions, kite designs, etc.), but aren't guitars (acoustic, electric) and guitarists (long- vs. short-fingered) also different from each other in substantive ways -- yet they manage to produce music from a common tablature?

Have at it ladies and gents... Grin

Ken
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tpatter
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« Reply #19 on: July 19, 2012, 11:26 AM »

I think this is a great idea.

One suggestion would be to go vertically, so the left/right is on the left/right.

I think its a good idea and you should explore it more. 

A few others:
- I think we need notations for pop, pull, lift.  For example, to me, the input to pull the wing up during the cascade is a lift, not a pop.  I would also say that the input during a flick-flack to come back from the nose away is a two-hand lift.  A pop will not work well there on most kites.

- Maybe also have a notation for slack (S) to indicate that hand should be applying no tension.  When new flyers are learning tricks, I see this lack of slack on the off-hand as one of the most common mistakes.


Great idea!
-Tom
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