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Author Topic: UL for rookie  (Read 1739 times)
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TJC
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« on: June 18, 2013, 12:49 PM »

Hi everyone! I'm Tom and new to this forum.

I'm a rookie trying to self teach myself to fly stunt kites. I guess the same could be said for most on this forum when they were new. That said, I have an E2 and a Quantum. Both picked up years ago but not flown. For training purposes, beyond youtube I have both the the Prism and Dodd Gross videos. Both are great learning tools. And, using them i 've managed to get basic kite control down. That is, i can fly anywhere in the window, do squares, circles etc. I can land consistantly without too much drama.  So now it's on to tricks.

Problem is - to learn tricks takes a lot of practice and that takes learnable wind conditions. I've got the time, but the wind has been either a no show or a blow out. Since there is little for me to learn by flying in high winds I will pass on that but the low winds are just as frustrating. These kites are too heavy to fly in low wind. Or at least too heavy for me to fly in low wind.

What UL kites would you recco to a rookie? I need something trickable and not overly fragile.

Thx for reading - I'll try to keep future posts a bit shorter.
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adx1592
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« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2013, 01:57 PM »

That's a tough one, honestly. I think a good bet for the money would be a Freestylist UL for Jon T and skyburner kites, or even a used BMK. Other kites are framed in 2pt rods which are more fragile but the freestylist is not, and all of kens kites usually have 3pt frames which are a bit less fragile. Another good idea would be the prism zephyr, although it isn't really a UL. Welcome to the forum!
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-Devin Cobleigh-Morrison
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« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2013, 02:50 PM »

Im in the same boat as you are.  I just got off the phone with john at sky burner.  After talking with him for close to 30 min I am going to be ordering my widow maker ul tonight.  I know anyone can tell you anything but after talking with him I believe if I was to have a problem with my kite he would back up his product.
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trigger
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« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2013, 03:45 PM »

some great advice... i have the zephyr and love it. it flys pretty low, MUCH lower than quantum. does all the tricks and i have never broken it
  can't go wrong with skyburner! i've met Jon, he is 100% dedicated kite guy. He spent time answering and helping me with my newb questions. i am slowly converting over. I just picked up an ocius sul. I've only had it 3days but it flys much easier than the zephyr down low and some things are easier on it already.  I think if i didnt have the zephyr, i would go for the WM ul.

plan on getting more.... and have fun!
jim
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drmndrew82
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« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2013, 04:19 PM »

Hi Tom,

The kites mentioned in this thread are all great kites. I recommended my friend get a Zephyr for lower wind flying and it seems to be the perfect fit. It is definitely more resistant to breaking than most UL kites, but it also will not fly as low as a Widow Maker UL will or other high end UL kites. With you being a new flyer I think the Zephyr will be your best bet because it will help you to learn to fly in lower winds without snapping in half when you nose dive.

Remember, flying in light wind takes time, but the more you practice the better you will be at it and then someday you will want to fly in the low winds.

I remember many days getting furious that the wind wasn't there, driving an hour to a kite field for nothing, and then going all the way back home without any flight time... Angry

One day I just kept trying to fly over and over and over again with no wind until I got a little better at keeping my kite in the air. Two weeks later I was learning tricks that I never thought I could do.

Good luck...
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Kite Bag: Skyburner: Widowmaker Std & UL/ I-Nak, HQ: Shadow, Flying Wings: Silver Fox 2.3 UL , Blue Moon: Mongoose, ITW: Kymera, Rev: (2) 1.5 SLE / 1.5 SLE Vented, Baressi Signature Vented, Kite Related Design: Fury UL, Fury STD, Fury Vented
Wayner
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« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2013, 09:23 PM »

A good list of kites.
 
The Freestylist is a great value for someone on a budget.

If cost is not an issue go with the WM UL.

BMK  mongoose and exile and not in production and hard to come by.

The Zephyr is in a different class. It is a light standard. It is more tricky but requires more wind. You use of the kite depends on your local wind conditions. Mine spends most if it days in the closet. But your winds may be different.

One other kite is the Shadow by HQ.

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TJC
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« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2013, 06:42 AM »

THX for some great reccos! Looks like i've got some homework to do. I've looked at the Zephyer and it definately could help. But then i read some debates about it not being as UL as Prism claims. No doubt it is great kite but not sure if it solves the problem.

I also looked at the WM. I really like that too! I didn't know it came in a UL version. And, truth is, at this point with my flying ability I thought I might come off as somewhat as a poser - low skill flying high end kite. I don't care about appearances but wondered if the kite was beyond my skill level. From what you guys are saying, that would be the wrong way to look at it. More like - view it as the right tool for the job.

How durable is the WM? Also, on the Ocius, what is the difference between it and the WM?

Again thx!
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alien
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« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2013, 07:13 AM »

Zepha can take a good rookie beating and the spares are a quick USPS away no matter where on earth you are!
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mtk beach flyer
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« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2013, 08:22 AM »

I am in now way a good pilot and the widow maker kites can do much more then I can throw at it at this time but the way I look at it is I would rather buy something I can grow into not something I'm going to grow out of.  If you have not spoken to John over at sky burner I reccomend you give him a call. After I spoke with him it gave me a much better idea of differences in his kites and I felt a lot more secure in pulling the trigger on a widow maker.
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John Welden
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« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2013, 12:05 PM »

Your E2 should do pretty well in light winds.  One way to get good at light wind flying is to fly a standard wind kites on days when a lighter kite would be easier.  Your E2 being hard to fly in light winds is 98% your skill level and 2% the kite being too heavy.
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jimstl
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« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2013, 02:50 PM »

Another approach is to get lighter lines for low wind days, it actually makes a huge difference, less weight and less drag.

LaserPro Gold 50# Spectra Line set is my recommendation.
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Jared
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« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2013, 06:58 AM »

For the money, I am thoroughly impressed with the Black Dog UL by Skydog Kites.  You get a low wind kite with a polyester sail that will fly down to almost nothing (I've flown in 1mph with 30' lines) for about half the price of a Zephyr or Widowmaker.
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TJC
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« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2013, 11:03 AM »

I've listed every kite mentioned and am going through that list right now. Looks to me that all have a lot going for them. So, I'll narrow it down. Of course more reccos are welcomed.

AS for using the E2 in low wind, I realize it's a learning curve thing. However, my goal isn't to learn how to fly a heavy kite in low wind. That will come with time. For now, my goal is to learn some of the basic tricks. And for that i need a kite adapted to the low wind conditions and one that will readily fly. Kinda like when you were learning to drive, first you needed a car that would start. That said, learning to fly the e2 in low winds is good advice and something i will do eventually.
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madhabitz
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« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2013, 02:59 PM »

... 98% your skill level and 2% the kite being too heavy.

I have to agree with this, being one who isn't there yet. I am doing better than a couple of years ago, but that isn't saying much. I look over at my friends who keep flying with what looks to be quite a bit of pull.... and I just have to shake my head. Other than being able to run backwards faster than I can run forward (Mike Baker you backwards-sprinter you), do you have any specific tips on how to do this thing?

Thanks!
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"I haven't failed. I've just found ten-thousand ways that won't work."   -Thomas Edison
TJC
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« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2013, 06:59 AM »

At this point i still have concerns with durability. I flew the E2 into the ground more than once this weekend. Still zigging every now and then when I should zag. I also pulled the kite out of the air more than once by over snapping the snap stalls in low wind. None of the crashes was what I call an "OUCH!"  You know - where the kite impacts and you say OUCH! Or some similar adjective! All were low speed. The E2 handled them all easily. I knew the kite was sturdy enough to handle them.

My concern is that a low wind kite might not escape so unscathed.

On the list of candidates on this thread I believe the Zephyr can handle some ground encounters. My question is- how durable are others on the list? I'm leaning towards the Ocius or the Widowmaker as a low wind trainer.
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